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What type of wood for MIJ re-rings?

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Unfortunately in the world of open forums, one can only convey intent, inference, emotion, and opinion with the written word. There is no additional indication of body language or tone to inform the reader with one's intent. To that end I found Calfskin's comments very informative and quite interesting and took it as only that.

His comment of "cheap, cheap, cheap" was correct and I did not find that to be a derogatory statement regarding these particular drums but instead a reference on the market value of the product and their cost of production. The fact is that these drums were cheap knock-offs of successful American drum companies and were never considered high quality nor even mid level quality at the time. The fact that the shells have cured over time, that their wraps were often very innovative and that many drummers started on these kits have given them a rightful appeal.

As said many times before, MIJ drums are a great way to get into restoration and collecting. There is nothing wrong with that. We all have seen the Coffeehouse Recreation kits and they are marvelous and what Jonni does with that from a charitable standpoint is extraordinary. If you are not familiar with his work you should delve into the forum archives and see for yourself. Very cool indeed and I am sure there are several young drummers that owe their skill to Jonni's willingness to give.

That being said, there are also a lot of guys that see those drums as being cheaply made (whether regarding cost, quality or both) knock-offs that flooded the market and were instrumental in the eventual failure of companies like Slingerland and Rogers. For them to "look down their noses" at these drums is also very understandable. Perhaps we should simply agree to disagree.

Respectfully,

Scott

tnsquint
Very proud owner of a new Blaemire Snare 6.5 x 14 made by Jerry Jenkins "Drumjinx"
Posted on 12 years ago
#11
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Thanks Scott, John and anyone else who sees the real value. Having said that, the MIJ did bring down the houses, but also allowed many drummers to become drummers that otherwise may not have been able to do so not for the "cheap cheap cheap". I am not espousing the new Asian drums, as they really are junk and you likely will not see them in 40 years.

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 12 years ago
#12
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So - let us review, shall we?

We can all agree that there were pros and cons to the flood of Asian drums into the American drum market.

Hey - I think I can just stop right there and we can all rejoice that we all can meet right here! :)

At least I hope that you are all here with me........and this is where we can meet to discuss - I don't know - drum playing perhaps!

I'll go first - Ringo - perhaps the most underrated and under-appreciated drummer of our era?

Cheers all!

John

I had a great day! Instead of sleeping in and wasting the day, I got up at 8 and I had all my slacking done by noon!

2Timothy1:7
Posted on 12 years ago
#13
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[COLOR="Red"]"For God did not give us a spirit of timidity, but a spirit of power, of love and self-discipline..."[/COLOR] of which I have little. (self-discipline)

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 12 years ago
#14
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....self discipline......

That's the one that I struggle with the most, despite the fact that I have a Spirit of it....

John, we all know you came from a passion for MIJs, a good, pure, harmless motive, driven by the hours and hours of labor you have spent on them - to all our admiration and resulting inspiration. Just remember that anyone (even appearing to be) dissing our MIJs are just missing out on our toys; the ones that sound great, many times look better, and costs much less such that we can still have money to feed our children. There really is no need to defend that. When we go MIJ, we have the best case scenario as far as I am concerned. The only reason I have a 68 Slinger is that the Christian sister wanted relatively little for it, as she was also happy to see it go to a good home and be used to make great music with a powerful message (The most powerful message of all time).

.....and I tell ya - that little drum solo/break in Carry That Weight/The End uses some strange sticking I tell ya - never appreciated it much until I had to learn it and play it for a Beatles Tribute Night.

John

I had a great day! Instead of sleeping in and wasting the day, I got up at 8 and I had all my slacking done by noon!

2Timothy1:7
Posted on 12 years ago
#15
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John, you are the one that I look for, knowing that you, as well as several other members, play for our salvation services. I am just an arrogant loser compared to you guys. I am no more than a drum tech, but I love the instrument. My younger brother was my mentor, as he was an amazingly powerful, Bonham like drummer.

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 12 years ago
#16
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It is unfortunate that a question asking about type of wood gets an implication laden response about the worth of a kit rather than a simple and knowledgable answer about wood type. This site has lots of opinionated participants and many threads seeking opinionated input on value and sound quality of drums. It does get tiring, however, to have to endure opinions on value and desirability to get to an informed answer.

For those of us not informed on how text based communication can work against the communicator, here's lesson 1:

>If you don't intend to shout, don't repeat words or use all caps.

>If you don't intend to be when answering a fact based question, don't expand on why something happened, just what happened.

If you don't intend to argue with someone, make someone feel attacked, cause a controversy, etc... start with these two simple rules. If you don't care how abrasive your comments are, ignore this post entrirely. I spend most of my time teaching teachers how to teach netiquitte, politeness and accuracy online, to their students. It is an essential skill for our online existance.

Just my :2Cents:

Brian

'65/'66 Slingerland Stage Band in Red Sparkle Pearl
'67 Rogers Buddy Rich Headliner in Blue Sparkle Pearl
'49 WFL 6.5x14 Contest Snare
'55 Slingerland 7x14 Hollywood Ace Snare
'70's Premier PD2000 5x14 Snare
50's & 70's Zildjian/Paiste Cymbals
Posted on 12 years ago
#17
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And a general addition to what NearlyBrian so eloquently stated:

I tell my kids to never post, email or text something that they would not be willing to say face to face. That tends to solve lots of problems.

I personnaly like overly informative answers as I generally find most things interesting, and the passing on of information is the primary purpose for these kinds of forums.

Let's try not to:

1.) Denigrate one another as that is not helpful. There are as many opinions about drums as there are styles of music. We are all entitled to our own.

2.) Be so quick to be offended. Sometimes we simply read too much into what other people say instead of just processing the information and then moving on.

Thanks to all of you for your insight and knowledge. I have really enjoyed spending some time here.

tnsquint
Very proud owner of a new Blaemire Snare 6.5 x 14 made by Jerry Jenkins "Drumjinx"
Posted on 12 years ago
#18
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John,

No, I'm not going to sit by silent and let your self esteem be damaged by some posts on a discussion board. Now, I may be wrong, but that is what I smell. You described yourself as an "arrogant loser". Arrogant - passionate, mixed in with some strong opinions and perhaps a type A personality.....but I'll also acknowledge the admission and the humility.

Then the way I see it is that there is healthy humility and then there is damaging humility, when it causes the self image to move south even a millimeter.....

...and I don't think anyone on here would call you a loser, even not any users who appear to be your enemies. Even if you are a weak player, most on this forum have discovered your charity as well as your very informative contributions, as well as the valuable tutorial videos you have produced on restoration. Finally, know that your humble post last night actually improves the image I have of you as a stand up guy, not the opposite. There is wisdom in humility (as I have noted - as long as it does not damage self image - sure there is a term for this somewhere).

Ok, regarding drums ;) we have established that most MIJ re-rings are not maple (few exceptions like Zim Gar) - so perhaps we can continue with a discussion of which is a better discovery or better for continued integrity of roundness - the 3 ply thins with re-rings, or the 6 ply or higher, thicker MIJs with no re-rings. I tend to get more excited about any with re-rings, but perhaps I need to rethink it. I have both BTW.

Also, maple is not the only hard wood out there for making drums - wonder if any on the MIJs are made from another harder wood?

Calf, please do not sit this out, as I value your perspective.

Thoughts?

John

I had a great day! Instead of sleeping in and wasting the day, I got up at 8 and I had all my slacking done by noon!

2Timothy1:7
Posted on 12 years ago
#19
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John!!!

A "loser"! I think not! You are one of the most admired people on this forum! Why? The facts speak for themselves. You are an honourable human being. You take on battles simply because you believe that you are right. As a former special education teacher, I have a warm place in my heart for the underdog. Keep on truckin', my friend! Fight the fights. Do what's right. Respect out, brother!!!!!

Brian

Just a drummer who loves all things about vintage drums! Nothing more, nothing less.
Posted on 12 years ago
#20
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