Well, I think I'm gonna have to waffle on ya. Upon closer inspection, the hardware, bass T-rods especially, are giving way to Pearl over Star. I really wish it were Star, but nice drums all the same. So now that they are cleaned up, and shiny,flowers2 how do they sound? And that 14 FT, is it three ply? If it is, I can tune that puppy up to...dare I mutter it...to sound like a Luddy...there, I said it....Keep on Pl

g'day from western australia,

i have just bought a 60s black jack kit on ebay... i plan on replacing all the heads, hoops, t-rods and claws... i will clean up all the lugs and get them re-chromed... as far as the wrap goes - it looks cool in the pics... but it is very tired... i will wait until the kit arrives and decide how i will get the best out of this very unique wrap...

the ebay link is:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190364639074&ssPageName=ADME:X:AAQ:US:1123

feel free to check it out and forward any tips on as this is my first restoration...

cheers,

wes.

Very nice find! Those are definately Star. The rail end caps are from the top of the Star catalog. Those are my favorite lugs. The wrap color is called Green Satin Flame, and it is going to look rough up close. Satin flame wrap is hard to keep through the years. It has very fine ridges in it, it is not flat cellulose with glitter imbedded in it. When it comes into contact with anything, it scratches, and it is very easy to scratch, which is why it will look rough when you get close to it. What are the sizes?

Hi Wes,Nice looking set,set is 60s--the t-rods will be metic,,I dont have any for the toms but i do have them for the bass drum if you need them..Mikey

I love it!!..play it and enjoy it.

cheers jonnistix,

i am pretty happy with it - the lugs are pretty classic!!... i've learned alot more about the drums since purchasing!! i i found the star catalogue u were talking about and pretty much found the exact kit in there... the wrap is "gold eddy satin flame"...

the sizes are 5x14" snare, (TWO) 8x12" rack toms (odd setup, but it is an option in the catalogue), 14x14" floor tom and 14x20" bass...

i plan on converting all the lugs from metric to standard by replacing the inserts... this will allow me to replace all the tension rods and hoops easily...

i don't know expect the wrap to clean up too well, i think it's had a tuff life!! but i'll just see how it goes... if everything else comes up well and the shells are in good condition, i may look at re-wrapping, but i don't want to spend much more $$...

i'll keep u posted on the resoration...

cheers,

wes.

This Hoshino (not Star!!!!!!!!) kit has black plastic bass drum hoops- I was so suprised when it arrived after the auction. It sounds great but those plastic bass drum hoops had to go. I wonder if the not Star -Hoshino company could have produced these BlackJacks?

[IMG]http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn87/Osakabop/th_kirin36-img481x600-12572527604a3xtd.jpg[/IMG]

Oh man... as if things weren't confusing enough!

O-bop, the blue sparkle Black Jack that Old School has does look like a Hoshino set. The lugs look like Hoshino and the floor tom leg mounts don't look like either Star or Pearl, and as you mentioned, the black plastic hoops. But, confusingly, the tom mounts look pretty much like Star's. And even more confusingly, the silver upright rectangle badges look just like Star's non-oval badge. DOH Take a look at the Japanese drum badge page.

Wesgat's gold/green satin kit, on the other hand, looks to be a textbook Star kit, just like the Star Stream Professional kit in the cataloge page. It has the satin finish, the off-set teardrop lugs, gray interiors, and definitely the Star floor tom leg mounts.

So again, we have two manufacturers making similar kits with the same brand name, OR, Hoshino and Star may have more of a connection than we thought they did. It seems that we see more overlap with Hoshino and Star made drums than we do with Hoshino and Pearl drums, so... It's just one hypothesis that I'm putting out there. There may or may not be anything to it.

The blue kit is pretty certainly Pearl. The rail end caps pretty much tell the story there. The green/gold swirl on the other hand...looks like a good copy of a Gretsch kit. Nice sizes too.

John, the tom rail on Old School's blue sparkle Black Jack set looks just like the one on O-bop's blue sparkle Hoshino. I know Pearl made at least 2 variations of their rail, do you have a pic of one (on a Pearl set) that looks like the ones on Old School or O-bop's set?

The distinctions between the brands dont seem to be holding up very well.

Take for example the below Pearl set, complete with Pearl badges.

http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=8920&d=1252171495

Notice the tom mount on the bass? 100% Star, on a Pearl badged kit. Also, notice the floor tom mounts, which we dont see very often, but are seen on this set, which was agreed upon as a Star made set.

http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10671&d=1258534495

I thought I had a handle on what was what, but now I really dont think I have my head around it. I mean, I have 3 Slingerland copy lugs in my basement right now. One says Pearl, one came off a 'Made In Japan' badged drum (Star, presumably,) and one is different from both of these, but came off of a tom that I thought was a Pearl based on the mount type.

???