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Dave Clark's English Rogers Restoration.

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This post should come with an obsession warning.

Its this one .............

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DAVECLARKFIVEPICS078-1.jpg[/IMG]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sehYnUVAcZM"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sehYnUVAcZM[/ame]

Presented by DC as a prize in a competition in 1966.

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Melodymaker26thMarch.jpg[/IMG]

I bought it from the winners.

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/DSCN2765_1.jpg[/IMG]

BASS

The front hoop had been taken off, like a lot of us did in the 70s, and lost it, along with the tension rods and claws.

For the auction we had found replacements, but the front hoop lacked Red Sparkle inlay.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/DSCN3334.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3346.jpg

What I started with

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3355.jpg

John told me that when he received the kit the heads had been played. He replaced a few but he doesn’t remember which ones. There are a lot of old heads on this kit – more on that later.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3349.jpg

Various sites of damage inside the shell where something (lighting) has been secured.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3351.jpg

Same damage viewed from the outside. The holes have been made rather untidily with something like a bradawl.

One of the collet nose/wing assemblies (that big wing nut thingy) on the bass drum spurs (legs) is of American manufacture. Someone must have lost the original and got a replacement from the US.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3358.jpg

Some of the lugs had cracked. Seven lugs needed to be replaced. Many of the tension rods and claws had seen a hard life too, and I replaced a few from my stash accumulated over the years.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3363.jpg

Both of the collets on the top of the bass drum which receive the tom tom arms have distorted the collet plates on which they sit, likely as a result of the leverage that the mounted toms have exert on the collets.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3376.jpg

The plates in turn have transmitted these forces to the shell. There is the beginning of some very slight distortion to the shell.

The fitting of the collet plates inside the drum is unusually untidy for an English Rogers. Makes you wonder if it was done in a hurry.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3377.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/Carolsphotos_0011-b.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3370.jpg

Years of build up of dirt.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3381.jpg

Stripped and ready for a clean.

The original bass drum hoop is made of solid beech. Boosey & Hawkes who made the drums would also use laminated birch. The replacement I found has the same profile (they can differ slightly) as the original but is of the birch variety.

The original hoop had grey/silver paint under the black.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3389.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3393.jpg

The scarf joint on the original hoop had started to come apart and there were various bits of damage that you find on bass hoops. Glue and filler to the rescue.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3396.jpg

The Red Sparkle inlay for the “new” front hoop came from Delmar and is an extremely good match for the original. The sparkle in these wraps is achieved by using flakes of aluminium foil. The flakes in the new inlay are slightly smaller than the original wrap, but you would need your specs. on to tell.

I had found an Ajax bass drum anchor, of the sort that was fitted on the original front hoop that John had lost (marked on photo) last year on ebay. I had bought it because I have an Ajax Nu-Sound kit which originally had one. I diverted it to this project - another blow to the stash.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/Carolsphotos_00161.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3407.jpg

It didn’t turn out too bad. Looks similar to the one below, wouldn’t you say?

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/LaterERRS3.jpg

I adjusted the colours on this photo. It is usually seen with the drums looking orange in colour. Someone at some point has got the colour balance out of whack.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3410.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Bass%20Drum/DSCN3422.jpg

TOMS

I didn’t think there would be so much to say about the toms. How wrong could I be?

These are the toms as I received them.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3333.jpg

Anyone familiar with American Rogers drums would notice that the collet plate on the smaller tom (12” diameter) tom is a little low. This is standard for English Rogers. The collet plate’s coach bolt is always approximately in line with the inner lug securing screw hole. The position of the collet plate on the larger (13” diameter) of the two mounted toms is clearly even lower, and that is not usual at all.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3531.jpg

On the left is a 13” shell that I have had around for some time. Someone has stripped and painted it, and elongated some of the holes. On the right is the 13” tom from the Red Sparkle kit. You can see how low in comparison the collet plate is on the Red Sparkle drum.

The question is, “why has it been set so low?”

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3453.jpg

When you look at the tom arms, the one on the players left (where you would expect to see the 13” tom) is angled, which reduces the height that the tom can achieve compared to the 12”. Extra height could be achieved by mounting the collet plate on the 13” tom extra low. This appears to be what was done. It can be seen here.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/dc5pic171.jpg

The inevitable conclusion is then that the 13” was always meant to be on the players left. Its shell was drilled in the factory to take that low collet plate. These drums were not purchased and then set up in that unorthodox way, the set was designed from the outset to be used in that configuration.

Posted on 12 years ago
#1
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The 12”

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3492-1.jpg

And rear

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3494.jpg

The 13”

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3498.jpg

and rear

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3500.jpg

The two toms are identical in the layout of their hardware apart from the location of the dampers. This is perhaps a little surprising as these days you would expect two mounted toms to be mirror images of each other so that badges and mounts end up in correct locations when the two toms are mounted on the bass drum. We have to remember that at the time this kit was produced hardly anyone was putting two toms on their bass drum and Boosey & Hawkes at least look as if they weren’t prepared for it.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3528.jpg]

Both of these toms have original English Rogers heads fitted.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3497.jpg

The lower edge of the outer oval of the logo says “Made in England under patent number ??????)

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3504.jpg

Below are the two toms in approx. the usual orientation that they are seen on the set. Note the position of the dampeners.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3521.jpg

Dampers were usually only fitted to English Rogers snare drums. I have only ever seen one other set that had them in the toms. It was very likely that they are there by customer request.

The 12” has a shell which is constructed of 3 ply birch plywood wrapped over laminated birch reinforcement rings which have staggered butt joints around the ring. Eddie Ryan, the veteran UK drum maker who served his apprentiship making English Rogers tells me that in the factory they refered to this as an “Edgware shell”. It is the most common seen in English Rogers.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3526.jpg

The 13” has a shell which is constructed of 3 ply birch plywood wrapped over solid beech rings which have a scarf joint which is glued and nailed. Eddie refers to this as an “Ajax shell”. These are a little more unusual but I have a few drums that have them, dating from 1961 through to 1967.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3527.jpg

The 12” has been drilled for hardware in the standard way. A lug has been positioned at the scarf joint of the shell which would clearly help with the strength of the joint. Unfortunately whoever drilled the 13” shell appears to have missed the joint by a whisker and large washers and shims have been used to try and rectify the situation. To make it all match large washers (usually seen helping to secure collet plates) have been used throughout the drum.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3518.jpg

The 13” tom has the air of a drum that was custom made.

The 12” has sustained a little damage

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3554.jpg

The drum was probably dropped and hit the ground on this lug. I managed to improve things slightly.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3570.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3569.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3547.jpg

The shell has similar damage to the bass drum. Something (lighting?) has been secured inside.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3536.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3539.jpg

This was the only tom that needed the hardware really cleaning up.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3563.jpg

SNARE DRUM

The snare drum is a standard English Rogers snare drum – I have several just like it – but this one is Red Sparkle.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3866.jpg

The shell is beech and the re-rings are laminated beech. It has a deep snare bed and sharp edges. It has these features in common with the later USA Holiday snare drums before the introduction of the USA Powertone with it’s shallower snare bed. I’ve never seen anything like an English wood shell Powertone.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3893.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3878.jpg

There were no cracked lugs! …………………… I know, amazing!

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3895.jpg

Despite being pretty dirty the snare turned out very nicely.

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3933.jpg[/IMG]

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3940.jpg

I noticed when taking the photos that there was a blob of glue under the script logo under the lower part of the “R” and the “o”.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3954.jpg

Looks like somebody broke their logo and glued it back on.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSC00017-1.jpg

The whole set together.

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3936.jpg[/IMG]

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3934.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3937.jpg

You can see why those collets have bent.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3939.jpg

It became clear as work proceded that some of the heads were original to the set. And one had not been moved since the set was new.

The 13x9 has original heads but it would appear that the batter and reso sides have been swopped at some point. The 12x8 on the other hand has original heads and the reso has not been moved since in use by DC.

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/Capture-1.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/scan00231-1.jpg

This photo is from 9th February 1964 (before the DC5’s first trip to America).

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Toms/DSCN3496.jpg

This is a photo I took before commencing work just in case there were any details I might miss. This head looks as though it has only ever been struck for tuning purposes. I placed the 12 and 13 reso heads back where they were when I got the set.

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/Snare%20and%20kit/DSCN3944.jpg

this kit was borrowed by Keith Moon at one point as below ...........

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/b00skp3k_640_360.jpg[/IMG]

http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/gear/drums/drumsborrowed.html#sdec1965dc5

.......... but also I posted this somewhere else and someone posted this photo ....................

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DC%20Thread/rollingstones_rogersdrumset-1.jpg[/IMG]

Who'd have thunk it?

Posted on 12 years ago
#2
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This is all so interesting; and congrats on the beautifull work you have done. I know and love B&H drums but have little knowledge of English Rogers. I've seen a few here in Canada but they don't show up very much-----probably not exported to N.A.

A couple of things have surprised me. 1) that the toms would be mounted without any reinforcement on the inside of the shell. Those Ajax ,birch shells are pretty thin and the thought of hanging that much leveraged weight , so close together on that little birch shell makes me wince. 2) Was the 13 ,left of the 12 because Dave Clark wanted it that way, or was it because the extra depth of the 13 required it to be over the downcurve of the bass drum? 3) That the Delmar wrap, was so close? I have tried to match up Delmar wrap to various older (50's and 60's) wraps and always found it had larger particles, or different colour or pattern. It makes me wonder whether Rogers stipulated the wrap supplier for their English made kits? Other English, sparkle drums I have seen(Carlton,Premier,John Grey) have had markedly different wrap than modern Delmar. Can't say this includes ,B&H ----maybe B&H was using Delmar stuff?------just some thoughts on a very impressive thread.

Posted on 12 years ago
#3
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Thanks for your kind comments.

I assume whatever English Rogers sets are over there may have been left behind by touring UK bands.

The lack of support surprised me as well. There is usually one of these .......

[IMG]http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb77/nutbox/DSCN1604.jpg[/IMG]

The 13" appears to be there because he wanted it there.

Ajax wraps are usually those thin celluloid types. This red is quite different, it is thicker because of the Al flake but the colour is a perfect match. I would doubt that the wrap came from across the Atlantic. The whole idea of the B&H/Rogers deal appear to be to produce in the UK. Everything apart from the snare strainer a butt was sourced in the UK (regardless of what the books say).

Posted on 12 years ago
#4
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That is really nice work and a fascinating post. Thanks for sharing!

tnsquint
Very proud owner of a new Blaemire Snare 6.5 x 14 made by Jerry Jenkins "Drumjinx"
Posted on 12 years ago
#5
Posts: 1296 Threads: 208
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Played by Keith Moon and Charlie Watts as well, fantastic!

Cool1

Never play it the same way once.
Posted on 12 years ago
#6
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great job restoring rock n roll history.

Posted on 12 years ago
#7
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Bravo l'ami, c'est magnifique!

Beautiful work.

And a pic of Charlie Watts with two toms, it's rare.

Eric

STAR WMP 22-13-16-cc14 (inside grey finish)
STAR Gold Flame 22-13-16-cc14
STAR WMP 22-13-16 (with inside rings)
HOSHINO red pearl 22-13-16-cc14
ASBA Stainless Steel 24-13-13-16
ASBA Stainless Steel 24-13-18
LUDWIG Black oyster (ringo!) 1968
LUDWIG Stainless Steel 1976 22-12-13-16

Zildjian, Bosphorus, Ufip, Tosco

and few more...
Posted on 12 years ago
#8
Posts: 3467 Threads: 116
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Great post...

Interesting stuff..Thanks

Cheers

'77 Slingerland 51N,Super Rock 24,18,14,13.. COW 8,10 Concert toms
'69 Slingerland Hollywood Ace
'75 Rogers Dynasonic 6.5 x 14, 10 lug COB
'77-78 Slingerland 6.5 x 14, 10 lug COB
'78-79 Slingerland 5 1/4 x14 8 lug COB
'79 Biman 5 1/4, Acrolite
'82 Slingerland 5 1/4 x 14. Festival COS
'84 Tama MasterCraft Superstar 6.5 x 14, 10 lug Rosewood
'98 Slingerland (Music YO) 6" 10 Lug Maple.. NOS
Zildjian, Sabian , UFIP & Paiste mix.
Posted on 12 years ago
#9
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I love these types of posts! While reading member's posts, I frequently notice the comment "if only these drums could talk". Well this is as good as it gets. I'm a trustee for a local museum in my town and this type of information/back story adds life to the inventory and displays. By having this documentation, you have transformed these drums from just being an instrument, to drums that are now "alive".

Have you ever tried to contact Dave Clark? Recreating that picture in the newspaper article with Dave, Carol and John would be the icing on the cake for these drums and complete your documentation. Having Dave play the drums one more time would be unreal. A 46 year full circle.

I just read the Dave Clark Wiki and unfortunately it says he stopped drumming in 1972, because he broke four of his knuckles in an accident. I hope he still plays, at least a little. If not, maybe Rick Allen (Def Leppard) should give him a ring?

Thank you, so much for sharing this with us. Now I'm going to go back and look at some more pictures.

- Tim

Posted on 12 years ago
#10
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