I'm known as a hard-hitting rock drummer. I do use 2002 as my primary cymbal, I don't bash cymbals. I play with a 2B stick on all gigs.

Have you tried the 2002 Wild series? They are a heavier version of the cymbal, somewhere between a 2002 and a Rude. I use them occasionally on a Shed show.

When I want to play a lighter cymbal (ride) I use a 22" Paiste 2002 crash. Works great!

I don't hit near as hard these days. Part of it is that my approach to drumming changes with each passing year ... Part of it is that my equipment changes with my approach ... and Part of it is that I'm freekin' too old and injured to keep slammin' the snot outta my body. Just can't take the abuse anymore.

With all that said, I've noted that 20 inch crashes did the trick. I played a nice 20 Paiste Sound Formula Full crash with another Paiste 20 and a pair of 18s for quick punches. These were augmented with a seriously aggressive 20 Sabian B8Pro China. Those did the trick for me.

I've also used the 20 and 18 Paiste Novo China's ... excellent in your face aggression.

Another outstanding over the top crash is the Sabian 18 and 20 Rocktagon's. Those things are seriously cool.

If you can get your hands on a 20 Rocktagon and maybe a 22 Rocktagon, put an 18 and a 20 Novo China on either side of those ... there would be no band loud or obnoxious enough to overcome that onslaught. You'd be a force.

I'm at all familiar with Sabian line, although would like to give a few a try. Problem with these cymbals, too many series that have suttle differences, but just enough to either like em or hate em. I do have a Rude 18" novo china, and you are right, in your face nasty trashy loud. the problem with that cymbal is it has a select purpose, and what I find is that its not often, the sound in unique...;I was thinking a normal china might be good to have for more variety. The 2002 wilds might work also, never tried the sound forulma, this can and does get expensive buying and flipping all the time. I'll give the wilds 2002 a try, and any maybe a rockagon..............

YES!!! The bigger, the better.......

I hit hard, drums or cymbals,...Changeing the snare head twice a week when I`m active type hard on the drums, and the poor cymbals, CRASH= smack, listen, grab it !! RIDE=tap, tap,tap, tap, tap, tap, ding !! SPLASH= hit the thing from the bottom !! HH= un-cup them before play`n !!

There be hard hitters here !!

Oh, CHINA= used up HH`s !!

I recall from seeing photos of your kit that you mount the cymbals fairly low. It would alter your playing style, for sure, but if you raise them a bit, you might find that simple physics helps you get more sound.

I don't play that hard (at least not hard enough to crack cymbals), but my crashes are all around head level (but angled). I'm getting more than enough (with plenty to spare) from 17" and 18" thin crashes. I also use a slightly longer stick (VF Terry Bozzio Phase 2).

The cymbals also have plenty of play on their stands instead of being clamped down. I don't know if that affects you, but I remember seeing Denny Carmassi many years ago and none of his cymbals budged an inch. It was painful to watch.

When I set my kit, pratice or seldom live, I keep my elbows lower than my shoulders and my knee at or slightly lower than my hip !!

When I started play`n long ago I would tighten the cymbals down and strip the threads from play`n, plus it effects the sound. Now I put a felt top and bottom then a large washer and snug it . The bottom of the HH sits on the white plastic tilter without a felt !!

I don`t use the cymbals nearly as much as the HH and drums !! Not even close !!

I just looked at the rockagon pies, they are not round? unusual design, kind of like a octagon...weird. Falling Do