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Info on a NIJ please.

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Hi Guys & Gals,

This is my first post but I've been a reader for some time...

I recently picked up an old MIJ (?) on ebay as a home practice kit, I was looking for something small but with some character. The mounted tom and floor have been re-wrapped very closely to the lovely mellowing yellowing pearl wrap on the floor tom.

10" Tom: having a closer look this is a newer drum with the old style mounting plate attached. The lugs match the floor tom but have standard thread tension rods.

15" Floor tom: Original wrap, lugs have an odd sized tension rod thread. Was missing the bottom rim and tension rods.(I've contacted Mikey already about some extra rods, which he says he can supply... Thanks Mikey!)

20" Kick: I think this a newer kick but with old fittings, It's very heavy for it's size. Tension rods have a lovely grip (what do you call the handle?) and again the odd sized thread. Two of the rods on the kick have been replace with a more generic grip (?). I'm hoping Mikey may be able to help me out with these as well. I do love the look of the consolette rail..but the adjustable section of the bracket may need some work as the teeth don't fully lock together

A week after I found this kit on ebay I spotted a Mounted tom with the same wrap and same mounting....so I bid and won it. This is a 13" tom but the lugs are slightly different but still that odd thread. There is an old glue residue patch were the badge should be. Oh and the lugs are mounted very unevenly.

I Haven't stripped it down yet as work keeps getting in the way but will make some time over the weekend. The insides of the kick and small mounted tom have been painted, I suspect to hide where the fittings have been removed and holes filled in. I'll find out more after the strip down.

So what can you guys tell me? Look forward to hearing your responses...

Cheers Tony

Ps: I'll be posting pics of an old Olympic snare I hope to refurb soon as well.

Thanks in advance.

Happy Drumming
Tony
Posted on 14 years ago
#1
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Sorry my typing isn't great obviously should be MIJ...not NIJ..

anyway heres a few more pics....

Happy Drumming
Tony
Posted on 14 years ago
#2
Posts: 657 Threads: 40
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Ah, MIJ White Marine Pearl (WMP) - you gotta love it!

Well, first of all, I think the 3 piece set is a Star made set, at least is seems like it at first glance. The lugs, floor tom leg mounts, bass drum tension rods, cymbal mount, and tom mount all point to Star. I would be interested in seeing a pic of the bass drum's interior, just to be sure.

Also, the set is a bit of a 'Frankenset' as the bass drum was from a set with center lugs (Ludwig Clubdate style) whereas the toms have the Slingerland copy lugs.

Are you sure the sizes of the rack tom and floor tom aren't 12" and 14" or 16"? I haven't seen a 15" diameter MIJ floor tom.

I think the 13" rack tom is a Hoshino made drum. The shape of the glue residue where the badge was stuck looks the same as other examples we have seen and the 'shark tooth' lugs match those as well.

The odd thread size for the t-rods were the slightly finer pitch metric sizes used in Japan back then. They are sometimes easy to find, and other times impossible. Either search out more of them or you can swap out the inserts so you can use standard size/threaded t-rods.

Looks like a nice project set. I think you'll be happy with it when you finish getting it ready to play. Please keep posting pics as you get it back together.

Posted on 14 years ago
#3
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The bass is most certainly Star, the rail end caps give it away. The rack, at least one, appears to be the Hoshino lug design. And the diamond plate is 2 piece, which is not typical of Star. Mine are punched rather than 2 pieces of metal bolted together. The interior paint would have been original from the factory as they tried very hard to emulate the Americans in every way, and if the bass is heavy, that is because it is likely a 6 ply solid mahogany shell, not the thinner 3 ply. I have yet to see a 3 ply from Star that is painted inside. If the paint is a tannish grey, or greyish tan, it is certainly factory, and the bass is 100% complete and correct as they made many kits like that.

So the questions remaining are where are the toms from? They don't match and are likely not Star but either Hoshino or Pearl made.

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 14 years ago
#4
Posts: 657 Threads: 40
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Bonzo, could you post a few more pics of the rack tom that came with the set? Are all the lugs the same on that drum? (Look very carefully, they might look the same but actually be slightly different.) The 2nd pic from the first post looks like a Pearl lug.

John, I think that the floor tom is a Star drum based on the lugs and the leg mounts. It's hard to tell from the photos here, but it looks like the rack tom might have both Pearl and Star made Sling copy lugs.

A Frankenset indeed! We are going to need pics of the drum interiors and close ups of the lugs outside and inside on each drum to get to the bottom of this one.

Posted on 14 years ago
#5
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And coupled with a 15" floor tom, I have not seen that before...wonder where it came from? Maybe a converted Ludwig to match? He is in Australia, so mix and match is definitly a possibility.

Blake, you ever seen a 15" MIJ floor tom?

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 14 years ago
#6
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What I think is this: the smaller racxk, a 10" 5 hole is something definiyly newer. I don't recall anywhere seeing an MIJ 10" tom in the catalogs. Interior pix are needed on all drums. And the floor tom, it has to be either 14 or 16 if it is MIJ. Again, never seen a 15. And the bass is correct, so let's leave it be. Those two are the mystery drums, as the 13" tom is correct as well. So, let's dissect the two oddballs.

Carefully examine all the lugs on the 10" tom, and the floor tom. And make certain the floor tom is indeed a 15, as it looks more tlike a 16 to me. And we would need to see some interior pix of them all, but more importantly the odd ones.

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 14 years ago
#7
Posts: 657 Threads: 40
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No, I've never seen a 15" MIJ floor tom. I think this one is an 8 lug 16". I've seen some 15" MITs, but they are 5 lug drums. This is definitely a mix and match set. The (first) rack tom is probably a later MIT with MIJ lugs thrown on it. Yeah, it does look like a deeper shell.

So I think the set is basically this:

20" BD, (probably) in it's original state, a later (early 70s?) center lug Star made drum.

16" floor tom, late 60s Star made, Sling copy lugs.

12"x10" MIT rack tom re-wrapped in WMP with a possible assortment of earlier Pearl and Star lugs.

13" Hoshino rack tom, original wrap (I would use this drum with the kit and set the other rack tom aside.)

Posted on 14 years ago
#8
Posts: 5227 Threads: 555
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The run down on your set.The first posted photos,photo#1-the bass drum and floor tom are Star looks like a 20" bass and 16" floor ttom Star never made a 15" floor tom.The badges were stickers Black with silver saying star ete--photo#2--The 10" tom does not look like a 12" tom is a newer M.I.J. or M.I.T. Star never made a 10" tom..Lugs on 10" are made by Pearl copys of slingerlands and to me don't match the floor tom lugs.Star copys of slingerland lugs are more rouned on top not flat on top like the ones made by Pearl..Photo#3--Bass is a Star likely a 3 ply shell with rings,sticker badge,On the tom mount the mount[rail] is Star also the mount itself is but that one was used on the lower end of Star drums with center lugs also the cymbal mount yours goes into the bass drum..On Star's upper end if you will the tom mount arm would be "hex" rod [like yours] but with-out the flat L piece at end it would have been a rounded end with teeth that would fit into a "diamond" shape mount on the tom mounted with three inter screws-your mount in mounted with four outer screws...Photo #4-The cymbal mount is Star again used on the lower end drums,the upper end drums mount would be a "diamond" shape mounted with three screws on the outer side of mount and would not go into the bass drum[[the tube]]...Photo #5 yes Star t-rods and claws...In your next posted photos--photo #1-10" tom is a newer one M.I.J. or M.I.T. star never made a 10" tom,the lugs are made by Pearl copy's of slingerland...Photo #2--Star floor tom 16" not 15" the floor tom leg mounts are Star also with the right wing-nuts also the legs are Star too..Photo #3,4,5, the tom is made by Hoshino,cant give you a name with the sticker badge gone it could be one of 30 or so names.the lugs will have No springs to hold inserts it just a nut hold into place in a slot in top of the inside of lug.So i would date the floor tom and bass late 60s--the 10" 70s-80s--the 12" tom 60s..Mikey

Posted on 14 years ago
#9
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Thanks for all the info, I'll do some further investigation, photos and definitely some measurements. Watch this space. I have to say I'm constantly amazed by the wealth of knowledge of the members of this forum. Cheers guys Tony.

Happy Drumming
Tony
Posted on 14 years ago
#10
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