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Does Changing Era-correct Hardware Constitute a " Modification"?

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Posted on 5 years ago
#1
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It's a "mod" only if you tell someone.

Posted on 5 years ago
#2
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Posted on 5 years ago
#3
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If you replace a part with the same exact part that is in better condition, that should not be considered a modification. Many vintage drums that we own have replacements of the original hoops, tom and cymbal mounts, tension rods, snare strands, snare strainers and butts, screws, washers, nuts, bolts, internal tone controls, etc. with the exact same parts.

No matter how far you push the envelope, it is still stationery.
Posted on 5 years ago
#4
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This question came to the fore (or at at least my consciousness) in relation to Cherie Willoughby of Repercussions. I believe she sold Repercussions some years ago (2011) and there are discussions here:

http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=31703

although you seem to have dealt with Repercussions as recently as 2017 asking about whether or not a strainer is original or swapped.

http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=60404

The Repercussions.org site appears defunct now. Anyway, the long and the short of it was that some people accused Cherie of taking a cavalier approach to parts swapping. Repercussions may have swapped period and manufacturer correct parts, I don't really know. I also don't really care except that silently swapping (nearly) period correct parts negatively impacts careful research about just when some hardware changes happened.

Can a drum be called "all original" or "unmodified" when period and manufacturer correct parts are swapped? It is a question where there are going to be some strongly held opinions.

I would tend towards saying that the phrase "100% factory original" or "unmodified" should mean all the original parts as installed at the factory. If some need to be replaced because they are damaged, then perhaps the kindest thing to potential buyers is to say "some parts replaced with period and manufacturer correct parts". A little long winded, but communicates the flavor of it.

I agree that the problem is with disclosure. I have a few old Ludwig drums and no way to know if the parts are as installed in the factory or if some were swapped out before I bought them. Given the way Ludwig did their assembly from bins of parts, how much should we really care whether a lug or tension rod came from the original assembly from the bin on the day? Does it really matter if a tension rod or lug came from the bin a month after the snare was shipped, but was substituted 43 years later?

There does seem to be a bit of "wiggle room" in terms of 100% factory original when it comes to the parts which wear out: heads and snares. People seem to be able to say "all factory original except the heads and snares" without things getting out of hand.

Posted on 5 years ago
#5
Posts: 5550 Threads: 576
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The hardware is universal, period but the shells are unique to themself ...

April 2nd 1969 scarfed pink champagne holly wood and 65/66 downbeat snare, and , supra same year very minty kit old pies
66/67 downbeat with canister
Super 400 small round knob
1967 super classic obp





once the brass ceases to glitter, and the drum looses its luster, and the stage remains dark, all you have left is the timbre of family.
Posted on 5 years ago
#6
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I would not consider the drum in your scenario to be "modified".

I would not consider the drum in your scenario to be "all original".

I would consider the drum in your scenario to be "restored" with exact OEM replacements of period correct parts. I would expect this scenario to be disclosed, if known, by the seller before funds change hands.

Wes

Posted on 5 years ago
#7
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From gunnellett

I would not consider the drum in your scenario to be "modified".I would not consider the drum in your scenario to be "all original". I would consider the drum in your scenario to be "restored" with exact OEM replacements of period correct parts. I would expect this scenario to be disclosed, if known, by the seller before funds change hands. Wes

+1 with what Wes said. I really think that sums up my feelings. My 1966 Rogers Headliner has been restored with "exact OEM replacements of period correct parts."

-Mark

Posted on 5 years ago
#8
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Agree with Wes and Mark. A restoration. Not modified, not 100% original. Replacement parts should be NOS or used OEM period correct originals. Reproduction parts should be disclosed.

Posted on 5 years ago
#9
Posts: 6524 Threads: 37
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From Hobbs

Say you have a 60's drum where the shell is perfectly fine but the hardware took it worse - rust / pitting / cracks / u-name-it. You decide to switch out some or all hardware for better PERIOD CORRECT ... meaning THE EXACT SAME HARDWARE FORM THE SAME TIME/YEAR.Is this a "modification"? I consider it in no way to be a modification. Comments encouraged and welcome,Chris

I as well see nothing more than you doing what the factory worker did, put this one on instead of that one from the same bins.

It`s a drum,.....Hit It !!

.....76/#XK9207 Phonic Sound Machine D454/D-505 snares !i
Posted on 5 years ago
#10
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