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Any Tricks For Tuning a 3 Ply Snare?

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I've got a US Mercury 3 ply luan snare that I can't get to sound decent and I know only a little about tuning.

This kit was mint with original heads on and has nice edges. I think the last guy before me to look inside these drums was a Japanese guy at the factory in 1966!

Is it possible this drum needs the right heads to do it justice? I bought a Remo Weatherking Ambassador for the bottom, an Aquarian texture coated for the top, and put PureSound 20 strand wires on it.

I've also heard conflicting advice on the tuning, some saying tune the bottom head higher, some say tune the top head higher.

Right now, I'm happy with the "tom" sound, but when I engage the wires, the snare sound is dry and hollow and doesn't have a nice decay. It kind of just lingers.

Any magic combinations to get the most out of this cool drum?

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Posted on 13 years ago
#1
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Bottom head tighter. This wood is not the most active and needs a boost.

What Would You Do
Posted on 13 years ago
#2
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[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qxm3QunDjUs[/ame]

Using this video is the best advice I can give. I use this exact system and get superior tuning results. Also, check to see if you have snare beds. If not, you may want to sand some in, about 1/8" deep by about 3" across the edge. I use Aquarian Z-100 coated top and a medium res and get fantastic results. The Z-100 is a single ply and they are really made for these thin shells. All of my 3 ply snares have this head on them. On top of that, if you have a Guitar Center or other decent drum shop close by, they are usually in a large box and run under 10 bucks. The coating is great for brushing as well, if you play brushes at all, you will love this head.

Also, I hate to say it, but the cheap Asian snares are best on these shells...I know, I know, but I have 12 of these old thin shell snares and have tried all sorts of combinations, always coming back to Aquarian Z-100/Evans medium and $6.00 snares. For the bass, I use an Evans EQ1, gives the bass huge range.

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 13 years ago
#3
Posts: 657 Threads: 40
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I think your head selection should be fine, so I don't see any problem there. Your snare wires, from what I've read, are the best available, so those shouldn't be a problem, either.

Is the shell of your snare a really thin 3 ply or a 5-6 ply? If it's a 3 ply, I would keep it tuned pretty low, these shells are so thin that they can and do cave in when they are cranked up. If your shell is a 5-6 ply, which I think it might be judging by the tear drop lugs, I think you can get it up to a medium tuning range, but I wouldn't go much higher than that.

When I tune one of these up, I also use the Gatzen method from the link that Jonni posted above. I would start out by tuning the reso head to a "G" or G sharp (A flat.) I wouldn't go much higher than that. On the batter side, tune it up to a "B" and see how it sounds. Then just go a bit higher from there, maybe a quarter or half a turn at a time, to find the sound you like.

One very important thing is to check how your snare wires are situated. There are a lot of vids on doing this. Just make sure you have plenty of adjustment available when you are tightening the engaged snare wires.

The snare beds, as John pointed out, could possibly be an issue as well. See if the drum has them. It probably does, but they might be pretty narrow. I cant really advise you on this because I'm not really comfortable modifying factory snare beds myself. I usually try to adjust other things to try to get a decent sound.

Other than that, maybe a touch of clear/white candle wax around the edges and some 3-in-1 oil on the t-rods to make sure they are lubricated to tune up easily, would be the only other tips I could mention.

And of course, this drum is what it is. If you're trying to get a really high crack out of this drum, similar to a metal snare, it's just never gonna happen. These drums characteristic sound is a fat, medium-pitched, 'smokey' sound.

My 2 cents, take it for what it's worth. Get back to us and let us know if any of these tips work for you!

Posted on 13 years ago
#4
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Is this a Star or Yamaha kit? At any rate, from the looks of it, there does not appear to be any snare beds. I blew up the photo and it looks like they don't exist, but then it is just a picture across the internet and I can't see through the hoop. Anyway, if you need any assistance, don't hesitate to let one of know. cn679 and I are among the ones who fool with these old MIJ drums more than most and know a few tricks of the tirade...I mean trade.

EDIT: I just did something I "forgot" to do the first time around...actually read the whole OP. So tis is an early US Mercury, which makes it Star. Likely there are no beds as they did not cut snare beds in most of these snares. I would guess their understanding of snare drums was not quite up to modern thinking, or any thinking, actually. I have had to cut fresh beds in almost every one of my 3 ply Star snares. It is really very easy, if you take your time and use the proper sandpaper, it only takes about 15-20 minutes. I think I posted a video on my youtube on hand-sanding snare beds.

"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 13 years ago
#5
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It depends on what you call a good sound.

I wouldn't expect too much from the drum, the plys are more than likely filled with voids from poor glue-up and a bad core. The edges may be too rounded over for anything other than the Tom sound you're getting, recutting the edges for more attack and definition. Although the wood might splinter up on the re-cut. A hazy on the snare side would give you more than a batter head.

Posted on 13 years ago
#6
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Yeah, I don't think there are snare beds cut. I'm not near the kit, I'm out of town...but the bottom head is the thin cellophane type.

Maybe I've got the heads crank up too tight. I'll start over...

Thanks for all the input!

Posted on 13 years ago
#7
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Hmmm. Thin cellophane type? This may be a long shot but are you sure you bought a Remo Ambassador Snare head and not just a Remo Ambassador Batter head? It should be very thin and clear and say "Snare" on it. The symptoms you describe sound like you might have put a clear tom head on. I've heard even seasoned drummers admit to that error occasionally.

Check that, then more on to the other issues mentioned. :2Cents:

Good luck.

Posted on 13 years ago
#8
"Ignorance may be overcome through education. Stupidity, however, is a lifelong endeavor." So, educate me, I don't likes bein' ignant...
"I enjoy restoring 60s Japanese "stencil" drums...I can actually afford them..."I rescue the worst of the old valueless drums for disadvantaged Children and gladly accept donations of parts, pieces and orphans, No cockroaches, please...
http://www.youtube.com/user/karstenboy
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Coffee...16613138379603
Posted on 13 years ago
#9
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From zenstat

Hmmm. Thin cellophane type? This may be a long shot but are you sure you bought a Remo Ambassador Snare head and not just a Remo Ambassador Batter head?

The words "AMBASSADOR SNARE" are visible in the picture he posted. He's good as far as head selection goes.

In addition to the snare bed suspicions, I think jonni might be on to something when he mentioned cheap wire snares versus PureSounds. I love PureSound Customs on my old Radio King, but they might be too dark for a soft, porous lauan shell and the head tension those shells are suited for. Thinner-gauge wires like the cheap-but-good Pearl S-022 snares might liven the drum up.

Posted on 13 years ago
#10
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