first of all (in my opinion) vintage cymbals have such a full/rich/versatile sound. we are as new cymbals are much more one dimensional.

right now i'm playing all vintage avedis zildjian.

14" hats from the 70's

18" crash from the late 60's

20" ride from the early 60's

and they all blend wonderfully together.

cymbals back then we're a lot different.

quality/sound/everything.

that being said not every one cymbal is the same at all.

you could hit one A and think it sounds great and hit another just like it and think it sounds like garbage. same for k's.

it all comes down to what you're looking for/what type of music you play.

my uncle has a 24" Paiste formula 602 ride and its prob the best/most versatile ride i've ever played. you can play any kind of music on that cymbal, it covers all the bases.

as far as some 50's hats.

i work in a used music store and we had a pair come in that we're in great condition, looked new from the 1950's and i hated the sound. they we're very dark/dry/stoic sounding. had a good chick..but that was about it. great for jazz some would say..but not for me.

i play all kinds of different types of music and for me it's finding cymbals that will be able to hold their own in any setting. never sounding "out of place"

you said you play new 2002's. those have a very unique almost tinny sound. i'm not so fond of them, too one dimensional for me.

maybe you would consider trying some black label 2002's from the 70's?

those cymbals make you work for what you play. what you play is what you get, they're not very forgiving. def for a more "experienced drummer"

but like i said..its all about what you're particularly looking for.

i would never buy a cymbal without hearing it first/playing one just like it.

hope this helped.

p.s.

this was from my experience (not meaning to offend anyone)

good luck on you're hunt.

you could spend the rest of your life looking for "that sound"

-shaun

There's a LOT of variation among old cymbals, so it's hard to say what a particular pair of '50s hats will sound like. To borrow some of your words, some will be bright, some will be dry, some will be gongy. You can make a little bit of a guess knowing the weights and the series (Avedis or K's?). Beyond that, though, there's not much of a way to tell without actually putting sticks to bronze.

All true, but I think Vintage '50s A hats will likely not be as bright or pingy as most current Z' hats. The difference in weight between the top and bottom cymbal will likely be less than in newer models. In fact on the 3 pairs of 50's A hats I have, the difference in weight between top and bottom is fairly slight.

On my three pairs at least, the "chic" is not as strong as many current pairs. One of my pairs actually has more of a "chuff" sound rather than a "chic".

For me, current A hats just don't cut it. I generally would rather risk getting a dud and pick up a vintage pair. I do make exceptions. I have a very nice pair of 14" K Con hats and 3 pairs of Bosphorus hats, all arond 5 years old. However, keep in mind my interest in jazz is guiding my decisions here.

Thanks for the feedback. These hats are 14" A's from the 50's. That is all the ad says. The price is $199. I can return them but I would be out shipping in both directions. Would it be better to find some from the 60's since one of you mentioned the 50's were lacking?

I personally prefer the three pairs of '50s I have, but I have also heard some very nice '60s hats. It depends on the sound you're looking for, and the individual pair you're considering. There are no guarantees. No one here could really advise you on whether you should go for these or get a '60s pair. Its strictly up to you.

My experience with all AZ cymbals is that the vast majority are only ok at best, many are downright horrible. One out a hundred (if that) is a gem. There's lots of gems out there though. Buying cymbals without trying them isn't quite as bad as getting a mail order bride from a newspaper, but in that direction.

If I had no choice but to buy untried, I'd make sure that the price was so low that I could resell them and at least break even. I have heard way more AZ cymbals that were dogs than good ones. They're hand lathed, and it's always been somewhat of a fluky craft, unless you buy Paiste's of which I've never heard a rotten one yet, and very few I'd want as well.

As I've said before, the deals are cymbals with small defects - cracks that have been repaired etc... and I'm probably alone in looking specifically for cymbals like that because they are, more often than not, more likely to be gems - that's why they got played so much and cracked. I do not have the fear most seem to have in defective cymbals - bring them on.

Almost all my good cymbals have defects, and I have other K's and A's that look perfect I still can't find a song for.

hi would your uncle consider selling the 24" Paiste formula 602 ride or getting a great trade?

I have a set of 14" mid 60`s zildjian hats that sound great! I think the top and bottom are both around 850 to 900 grams. a while back I picked up a 50`s top hat that is around 700 to 750 grams, loaded it up and I dig the sound even better. Good luck man! its like "rolling the dice" when you gettum online.

if my uncle did consider selling/trading..

i'd be first in line.

;)