just got this fab British Piccolo Snare.. 14"x4",12-strand snare wire ("Made in England"), 8-lug die cast rims with slot-headed bolts and it has the old Oval Badge..serial number inside is 28929
does anyone out there know what year it could be please or any other info??
thanks gang
Jump For Joy
These are great drums, Dave---I've always considered them the equal of contemporary Premiers. Perhaps Roger Kelly would be able to date the drum. I think the model was the Snapper. I have a couple of these kits in W.M.P.; one with a 14 x 6 COB snare drum. The shells are usually Birch with sometimes beech r.r. ---oval badge is likely 50's.
These are great drums, Dave---I've always considered them the equal of contemporary Premiers. Perhaps Roger Kelley would be able to date the drum. I think the model was the Snapper. I have a couple of these kits in W.M.P.; one with a 14 x 6 COB snare drum. The shells are usually Birch with sometimes beech r.r. ---oval badge is likely 50's.
Many thanks for that Phil and hope you ok,as its been a while... if you're out there Roger please could you help mate in dating the year of my Picoolo please..it has the number inside ! thanks
hello
B&H serial numbers don't contain specific date information but they do run chronologically so can be used to help dating.
all the Hawkes & Sons Ajax i have seen (with the winged roundal badge) are in the range 8,000-10,000. this badge was used from 1927-30
after the merger the triangle badge was used 1935-1939. all the serial numbers on these drums fell in the range 10,000-20,000.
after the war the first oval badge was used and the earliest toms i had with this badge had serial numbers of around 21,000, i guesstimated these to 1946/7 taking into account some other factors as well
most of the 60's drums (including English Rogers) i have seen are in the range 90,000-120,000 (production ramped up because of the 'group explosion')
your drum is in the 28,000 region AND it is a piccolo model which in catalogues were being trumpeted as the 'new' thing around the early to mid 1950's following trends in USA. i think it was just to save on scarce raw materials.
at arm's length, i would estimate that your drum is around 1951-1953.
QUALITY
Boosey and Hawkes Ajax drums are indeed superb instruments and before 1969 some of their products were better than premier. however, some of the interior finishing quality is variable and is less pleasing.
please look here http://ukdrums.weebly.com/buying-tips.html for a couple of introductory notes about why the quality of UK drums is poorly understood.
helloB&H serial numbers don't contain specific date information but they do run chronologically so can be used to help dating.all the Hawkes & Sons Ajax i have seen (with the winged roundal badge) are in the range 8,000-10,000. this badge was used from 1927-30after the merger the triangle badge was used 1935-1939. all the serial numbers on these drums fell in the range 10,000-20,000.after the war the first oval badge was used and the earliest toms i had with this badge had serial numbers of around 21,000, i guesstimated these to 1946/7 taking into account some other factors as wellmost of the 60's drums (including English Rogers) i have seen are in the range 90,000-120,000 (production ramped up because of the 'group explosion')your drum is in the 28,000 region AND it is a piccolo model which in catalogues were being trumpeted as the 'new' thing around the early to mid 1950's following trends in USA. i think it was just to save on scarce raw materials.at arm's length, i would estimate that your drum is around 1951-1953.QUALITYBoosey and Hawkes Ajax drums are indeed superb instruments and before 1969 some of their products were better than premier. however, some of the interior finishing quality is variable and is less pleasing.please look here http://ukdrums.weebly.com/buying-tips.html for a couple of introductory notes about why the quality of UK drums is poorly understood.
WOW..thnaks so much Roger for all the information and knowledge you have passed on and a big thanks for all the history on British Drums from your site, which i might add is absolutely fantatsic !!
helloB&H serial numbers don't contain specific date information but they do run chronologically so can be used to help dating.all the Hawkes & Sons Ajax i have seen (with the winged roundal badge) are in the range 8,000-10,000. this badge was used from 1927-30after the merger the triangle badge was used 1935-1939. all the serial numbers on these drums fell in the range 10,000-20,000.after the war the first oval badge was used and the earliest toms i had with this badge had serial numbers of around 21,000, i guesstimated these to 1946/7 taking into account some other factors as wellmost of the 60's drums (including English Rogers) i have seen are in the range 90,000-120,000 (production ramped up because of the 'group explosion')your drum is in the 28,000 region AND it is a piccolo model which in catalogues were being trumpeted as the 'new' thing around the early to mid 1950's following trends in USA. i think it was just to save on scarce raw materials.at arm's length, i would estimate that your drum is around 1951-1953.QUALITYBoosey and Hawkes Ajax drums are indeed superb instruments and before 1969 some of their products were better than premier. however, some of the interior finishing quality is variable and is less pleasing.please look here http://ukdrums.weebly.com/buying-tips.html for a couple of introductory notes about why the quality of UK drums is poorly understood.
The decline in the British drum industry is clearly linked to the shallowness that pervades popular culture. It is unfortunately , everywhere to be seen: all around us. In the case of the British drum companies however, they got a double whammy of it.
Not only did almost everybody in the U.K. and elsewhere lust after the Americanization of music and the instruments that went along with it and therefore eschewing professional English instrument makers but the flood of cheap Japanese crappy copies of American brands took away the entry level market as well. I mean why would anyone buy an Edgware kit with 8 lugs, diecast hoops,birch shells and impeccable chrome when for close to the same price you could get a genuine Slingerland copy complete with genuine self hammering cymbals. I mean what a concept----leave the cymbal hammering up to the drummer and they didn't even have to use up any extra time to do it----they could do it while they were demolishing the drumkit?
+1 calfskin, well said.
