Dave Clark? LOL

William Ludwig Sr. and Jr. were incredible businessmen and the old Ludwig company was absolutely the most successful drum manufacturer in history. Although I am a Ludwig AND Rogers fan, the fact is that Ludwig put faaaaarrrrr more effort (and money) into promotional/advertising stuff than did any other company. That's a big reason why lots of famous drummers were on the Ludwig roster.

Gretsch was always known as the jazz drummers' drums.

Slingerland was VERY close to Ludwig in terms of shell construction, but they were always second-to-Ludwig in terms of sales.

Rogers had the most innovative designs and highest build-quality, but couldn't hang when foreign competition entered into the game.

Ludwig built drums that were competitive and sold more of themby using superior business practices -such as spending money to get high-profile endorsements.

Any of the drummers who endorsed Ludwig would have sounded just as good on any other contemporary brand of drums....because good drummers sound good regardless of the drums.

Ludwig did, indeed, buy the best stable of endorsing artists of any drum company until Pearl, Tama, and DW got into the paid endorsement business. Rogers drums took a different road by building the most innovative and highest quality drums. The money people at Grossman (right or wrong) did not allocate very much of their budgets to paying endorsing artists. CBS continued on the same path even when it would have been beneficial to join in the payola circus. Slingerland's catalogs impressed the hell out of me from the time I was about ten years old. The Slingerland roster of endorsing artists was more impressive to me than the Ludwig roster in their catalogs. Starting with the British invasion, Ludwig took the upper hand for rock drummers. But, I was already very happy with Slingerlands and Rogers. Let's not forget that for fifty or so years before Ludwig and Slingerland made drums, UG Leedy ran the worlds largest drum manufacturing business.

Ludwig has patrick keeler, thats enough for me.

Patrick Who?

You make some very good and very valid statements. When I first got into drum set playing in the late 50's, I didn't know anyone who cared about or even knew about who made the shells for whom or how many plies there were in a shell. About all we knew was that Japanese import drums used crappy flimsy shells compared to the American made shells. I gigged with a set of 1961 Rogers Holiday drums with B&B lugs. For the three years that I owned them, I never had a lug go bad. Maybe there were hairline cracks, but I never looked for any cracks. My original Swivomatic bass drum pedal served me well for over twenty years of gigging. I replaced several parts on it over the years. I found Slingerland drums from the mid 50's through the late 60's to be very consistent as to sound and feel. That period of Slingerlands and the SlingerLeedy drums are like my favorite pair of old jeans. They are very comfortable. I would bet that this is how you feel about Ludwigs.

Look at my user name and take a shot in the dark on where I stand on this bit of discussion.

I LOVE Slingerland drums. There is enough variance in shell/edge build about every six years that it's possible to justify owning several kits over a thirty year span of manufacturing guilt free. They are very different beasts. (60-natural African Mahogany/poplar/AM with no vents and very rounded edges, 66-painted AM or Maple/poplar/AM with vents and a slight edge with round over, 71-super thin clear AM or maple/poplar/maple or AM with vents and a sharper edge, 76-clear very very nice maple/poplar/maple with vents and a very sharp edge). Sometimes these had a little variance, depending on the finish.

Rogers has made the best sounding jazz kit of any I've ever owned. From a whisper to a growl to a bark, they speak clearly and with authority. I look forward to picking up a nice 22,13,16 setup eventually.

My first real kit was a 64 Ludwig red sparkle SuperClassic. I held on to it for years (bad story there). I've owned several Ludwig kits, to include a 71 SuperClassic and a 80 Big Beat (2 of many kits). I don't dislike Ludwig drums. Heck, I've owned quite a few Ludwig kits. That's a pretty clear sign right there. But, they just don't speak to me like the Slingerland drums do. That's really all there is to it.

I've owned quite a few Gretsch kits. None blew me away.

I had both Rogers and Ludwig kits. I want both of them back, especially since my Rogers were Champaign sparkle and I had a Ringo kit. I also had black and blue label 602's in that mess o'crap. I wish I didn't have to get rid of those like I did when I did. My first wife was culprit; however, I blame myself for not digging in my heels and saying "screw it!!!" as she was nothing more than a weird control freak. I ended up losing my stuff but gaining my freedom and sanity when we parted ways. The current Mrs. bunnyman would love me to get these kits back *IF* it didn't cost me a mint.

But I have to be blunt- I had NEVER heard of Rogers drums when I got that kit. This was 1989. Ludwig was another name for a drum kit back when I was a lad, just like "Kleenex" was a another name for disposable handkerchief.

Patrick Keeler is a fantastic drummer who plays for The Greenhornes, but more notably for The Raconteurs.