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Ludwig Large Classic Lugs

Posts: 60 Threads: 14

I removed the wrap from my c. '71 Ludwig kit yesterday, and today I laid out all the 'large classic lugs' or 'tension casings'. When I was taking them off I noticed that there were a variety of different mounting screws on mine. When I laid them out I found that I also had a variety of different castings, six different types across the kit (see photo).

Does anyone have a photo and description of what sort of mounting screws should be used (3 ply kit)? Also, the actual spec/dimensions of the screws and washers would be good. I used a 6 mm spanner to remove most of them but don't think they are actually metric heads? Some of them had slotted heads also. I'd like to identify how many of my fixings are 'correct'. Not sure if the threads on the lugs with different screws will be damaged at all (I don't know how to tell if all the screws are imperial fittings, or if some are metric). I guess I can try screwing in the correct fixings to them all in turn once I know which fixing is correct.

Oh, removing the springs etc from them there are numbers inside. From left to right on the photo, they are all 2243 then 3, 1, 4, 4, 3 and 2 respectively. The felt, or whatever it was, on the second one from the left disintegrated when touched, and as it's '2243 1' I'm assuming it was maybe the oldest, and those are casting revision numbers or something? Just thought it odd that the numbers weren't 'all' different as they all look different.

I notice that on the Ludwig Replacement Parts pdf here http://www.ludwig-drums.com/pdf/av1453.pdf they list the 2243-B Large Classic Lug, which I take it is modern equivalent with no spring. They list two types of mounting screw, one for 'classic wood shell' and one for 'super classic wood shell'. I take it one of these means 3 ply and one 6 ply? Would these be the same fittings that would go in my vintage large lugs?

Thanks,

Richard.

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Posted on 13 years ago
#1
Posts: 60 Threads: 14

Sorry, just chatting away to myself here, but does anybody know what the difference is with:

P-22491 Mounting Screws for Super Classic Wood Shell

and

P-22492 Mounting Screws for Classic Wood Shell

I'm wondering if they (current production Ludwig fittings) would fit the large classic lugs on my 1971 kit which is currently completely disassembled for a hair cut and shave.

Cheers,

Richard.

Posted on 13 years ago
#2
Posts: 1212 Threads: 37

I think in the pic they are (L to R) newest to oldest versions...

Ludwig had to beef them up over the years as the older ones would break..

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Posted on 13 years ago
#3
Posts: 5227 Threads: 555

Hey Richard,Now for your questions on the lugs.In your photo the first one on the right is pre-1965,,the lug next to that one is after 1965,,the next one is 1970...the last three are 1980s to 2002 or so..As far as the mounting screw iam not sure of part number but Ludwig does make two lenghts of the screws the shorter ones are for 3 ply shells,the long ones are for 6 ply shells...The screws you posted are the right ones for your lugs but it looks like you have a mix of 60s-70s screws..the 60s look like a flat silver paint,the 70s are a clear looking silver paint...As far a size of the mounting screws the "hex" heads are 3/8 heads threads are also the same if i recall right....Mikey

Posted on 13 years ago
#4
Posts: 60 Threads: 14

Thanks for the info.

The UK Ludwig Distributor reckons I'm looking for the 'super classic' ones for my 3 ply kit, and that the 'classic' ones are for thicker kits.

Posted on 13 years ago
#5
Posts: 5227 Threads: 555

From Richard W. Rinn

Thanks for the info.The UK Ludwig Distributor reckons I'm looking for the 'super classic' ones for my 3 ply kit, and that the 'classic' ones are for thicker kits.

Hey Richard, I for got to say i have the origial screws if you need to add them to your list of parts .....Mikey

Posted on 13 years ago
#6
Posts: 538 Threads: 84

as far as modern ludwig lugs,they make 3 sizes of screws for lugs.i used to work for the former west coast ludwig artist rep,and i use to replace parts on the loaner kits,as well as for customers in a retail store were they had old lugs (as back as the 50's atleast) but no screws,and they worked with no problems.i have bags of these screws because when i would replace lugs,we were left with the other 2 unused.

if there are some differences in some screw sizes/lengths say...from the 50's and back,i would not know.perhaps another forumite knows the answer to that.i also don't claim to be a ludwig expert.i just know what i know from my old job.

in the past,when you bought a lug (90's to now) it would come with all 3 sizes. i presume that hasn't changed. here's a pic of a new lug.its hard to see (camera sucks) but it comes with 3 set of screws included. next to that,is the 3 sizes out of the bag.

anyway,the screw sizes (as in thread pitch which is 8/32 according to my ludwig parts books) has never changed for ludwig lugs that i'm aware of.the LUGS have been beefed up thru the years,but the lug screws and threads have not that i'm aware of.

for wood drums the 3 sizes are small (3 ply) med (4 ply and modern 7 and 8 ply) and large (6 ply) the LENGTHS of the screws fit those model year of shells.the sizes are:

-5/16

-1/2

-5/8

so to answer your question,any new ludwig lug screws will fit the lugs you have (i'm not counting rocker or even snare lugs,though they work for lugs on wood snares...) i would also presume any old ludwig lug screws will also fit various years of ludwig lugs.

the part numbers you listed refer to the length of the screw.if you prefer original screws for you kit,i'm sure someone on here can point you in the right direction.

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http://www.drummerfish.weebly.com for drum parts, drum promos , swag, promo media and more for sale
Posted on 13 years ago
#7
Posts: 60 Threads: 14

Thanks, Drummerfish, most informative.

When measuring the mounting screws, are the measurements you've given the thread and the head of the screw, or just the thread?

I want to measure the screws I took off the kit to ascertain which ones were actually the correct length. I've got two main lengths (so one will be wrong), and a few oddball ones.

Posted on 13 years ago
#8
Posts: 60 Threads: 14

...another thought...

Is there a way to measure the thickness of the drum shells, just to check that they're all the correct thickness for a 3 ply that I 'presume' them to be?

I have a micrometer, but the maple reinforcement hoops would get in the way from me getting at the shell proper.

Posted on 13 years ago
#9
Posts: 538 Threads: 84

the measurements listed are from the ludwig parts catalog. but its common knowledge when measuring screws,its from the bottom of the washer-down. you don't include the screw head or washer.

as for measuring the shell thickness,its not nessessary since you already know its a 3 ply shell (going off what you wrote originally) so it would be the shortest screws that will fit correctly. the 1/2 screws would be too long.

i think i read a post here from someone who has original period screws.

http://www.drummerfish.weebly.com for drum parts, drum promos , swag, promo media and more for sale
Posted on 13 years ago
#10
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