Hi Ronnie...and Welcome to the forum!

I know that Ludwig switched to COS in the early 60's, but not exactly sure when. We've got some great folks here who really know Ludwig and will chime in when they see your post. I have a 1961 Super Classic snare drum that has COB hoops.

-Mark

The COB to COS started in late 64/early 65. In 1965, and even into 1966, it was not uncommon to find a snare with 1 COB and 1 COS.By early 1966 the changeover would have been mostly complete, although there are anomalies spanning the 60's and early 70's. The is not definitive start/stop known, just a range. Most would surmise that 1.6mm COS would be considered the correct hoops for a snare from 1966.

Thank you Mark. I love that Super Classic, very nice.

Thank you Rotarded, your information is so helpful. You have answered my question in great detail. You have excellent Ludwig knowledge. It looks like the hoops I have are correct.

Thanks again to both of you.

Rotarded is right on the money. Some other tidbits of mid 60's hoop info....I have had two different '64 Pioneers with nickel over steel hoops. Have many '65-'66 drums with one brass and one steel. Also....during this period made drop gate snare side hoops in brass (common) and also in steel (not common). They also made a non drop gate in steel ( common) and in brass (not common). You can often spot the brass hoops if the drum is not been detailed but the hoops still look very nice (no rust).

Hi mlayton. Thank you for the info. Thats very interesting. It seems that there was no rhyme or reason with the hoops Ludwig used in the mid 60s. Do you think possibly they were trying to use up old inventory during Ludwigs switch to all COS hoops?

There used to be some video on youtube of home movies that Bill Ludwig took in the Ludwig plant in the early-mid sixties. One of the videos showed them making the hoops which then went into big stacks for use later on in the production process. Figure that at some point in 1965ish they decided to switch to using steel (probably brass became more expensive than steel at that point) and started producing COS hoops. New production would end up on the top of the stacks and get used first so when they got down far enough they might grab an older brass hoop that had been sitting lower in the pile. Of course they kept making new steel hoops which would continuously be added to the top of that pile. Once they had been chrome plated they all looked the same so the worker assembling the drum would not have been able to differentiate between the two (nor would they have cared). Depending on production rates of both hoops and drums it may have taken a couple of years until they had used up all the COB hoops they had produced before the switch in materials. Hoops don't have an expiration date so there was no reason to rotate their stock and use the older ones first. Eventually all the brass ones did get used though and from that point forward all the drums were strictly equipped with COS hoops. That's why there is no hard definitive changeover date and how COB hoops continued to show up on some drums well after the steel hoops first appeared.

Hi KO. That makes complete sense. I especially like and agree on what you said "Once they had been chrome plated they all looked the same so the worker assembling the drum would not have been able to differentiate between the two (nor would they have cared)". That makes complete sense, without putting a magnet on the hoop you can't tell the difference and they certainly weren't going to take the time to do that, they are on a production schedule and trying to put drums together as quickly as possible. I have decent Ludwig knowledge but you guys are on another level. So thankful to add this to my memory banks. This really helps with one of the 1966 snares (Jazz Fest WMP) I'm restoring now, the top hoop is bent in several places and I have just purchased a 60s COS hoop on eBay. Wonderful discussion.

Thank you all.

Ronnie