Nope. What was your initial post, that you would feel the pangs about?

I am not feeling any pangs (no pun intended), You just lost me with your post that seems to be commentary and sage life advice re. something other than what I initially posted.

just scattin' off of this.

I'm new here, but not new to forums, both moderated and unmoderated (Usenet, for example).

The part of this whole discussion that bothers me most is the use of the word "community", mainly because I see the changes and guidelines as counter-productive to community-building. In fact, I see it as anti-community.

This really confuses me:

I don't see this being much of a community if this is adhered to.

For example, I'm a member of another forum, which is centered around a particular family of trucks. While the original intent of the site was to showcase and discuss modified trucks for off-road use, the site quickly grew into a resource for people such as myself, who just came looking for assistance in repair or restoration.

We have our off-topic areas, and at 12,194 registered users, many of whom pay a yearly fee--myself included (as opposed to the 6567 registered users here), and a HELLUVA lot more traffic than VDF sees, we manage to keep the sub-forums fairly ON-topic. General stuff stays in the general section. Year-specific questions stay in their respective areas as well, for the most part. Diesel-powered trucks have their own sub forum, etc...

What's the point, you ask? Well... We actually ARE a community over there. Friendships are made because personal relationships are not only allowed to publicly flourish, but actually ENCOURAGED. Yes, there are some disagreements occasionally. You'll never escape that. But for the most part we're a well-behaved bunch of adults that rarely require intervention from a moderator.

There was discussion of "cliques". Well, I don't know if I'd call The Brotherhood (as we call it) on my other forum a "clique", per se, but it is a well-known fact that you don't just buy your way in over there. Respectfulness and a willingness to lend a hand builds mutual respect among members that can't be bought with a subscription fee or a high post count.

I have several phone numbers saved in my phone of guys I've never personally met. I've spoken to many of them several times. Met a few myself. I've seen members take road trips and stop and stay with other members along the way--having never personally met them beforehand. I've witnessed members shipping parts to other members for FREE to help them get their vehicles back on the road (this happened to me). I've seen The Brotherhood collect and donate money to help another brother in need. I've watched countless numbers of people post about their personal problems in the off-topic area, and watched as good, honest advice was dispensed (with actual care behind it).

Now... I don't expect all of that out of this place. Nor do I need it (I already have my other forum). But I feel that this place will be a very cold and unwelcoming place if public friendships are discouraged.

Otherwise we're just a bunch of nameless, faceless screen names. Doesn't sound like a fun place to be, to me at least...

Just my $.02. Take it for what it's worth.

We do a lot of those things.

Maybe so, but I believe it would happen a lot less if no personal relationships were allowed to flourish.

What are you talking about? We've had seven men's clubs form, three marriages, and fourteen babies born out of wedlock. We are a seriously personal bunch.

Good grief. Develop all the personal relationships you like jonrpick! I mean that in the most sincere way too. Many members here have done just that. There is no policing... this forum isn't a Dictatorship... and for the record, I don't think David meant what you had quoted to be interpreted quite that way... truly. If you were to take some time and probe backwards through the posts you would see very little, actually almost no moderator editing/involvment. Clearly...

... you are welcome to remain!... or you can choose to move on if you aren't all that jazzed with the way it works here. Should you so choose, enjoy your stay!

Tommyp

Originally Posted by Webmaster

"As we create friendships we need to try and keep them apart from dealing with posts and new members.

Think of it as a business level work relationship! You can go out and have fun with the people from work, but come Monday morning it is back to focusing on the job at hand."

I think you misinterpreted this Jonrpick. The webmaster, David, is not saying the we the forum members need to try and create friendships that are like a business relationship, he is speaking of himself and TommyP our supermoderator. Because they run the show, in order to keep it on track, they need to treat any friendships they themselves develop on the forum on a business relationship level. This way things can continue to run smoothly.

Am I close in my interpretation TommyP and David? :D

Very interesting thread here. This part of the original post is what caught my attention.

"I get a little intimidated at times when I cruise the forum because the tone can be somewhat less than cuddly. I hope new members are truly welcome here, I'm wavering!"

I think this is from recent posts and part of the new feeling the forum is portraying to the outside world.

What we see and think is not what new visitors think. If they feel they need to work to become a member or even ask a question, then the forum has not done its job.

The forum is thriving behind the scenes and friendships are growing and developing.

Those group relationships can and do take over a forum and appear to the outside world as the ruling body of the forum and if a new member upsets anyone in that group, the other members tend to show that group power and yes, the new member does not feel welcome.

Going into an unknown location where there are 5 people around a table would make anyone uncomfortable and think twice about staying.

Sure the 5 have a great relationship and might be the most friendly group of guys, but it will stay the same group of 5. I would not want to have to prove myself to get into that group of 5! or feel I need to earn their respect, or pay to be in that group for that matter.

This post goes into more detail about the forum and history. Click Here

Post 16 by me explaines some of the history and the original basis for the forum. Also, the reasoning for making some changes to the forum sections.

The forum changes are purely ways to keep certain content off this web site. I did not just say these are closing and everyone move on and get over it... I made unique places that can and will grow over time and the members here if they so choose can join them on the ground floor.

That is exciting to me and just another way to show that this is a community of drummers that can be friends and also buckle down to the business at hand on this forum.

If you want to have fun and post a video of you playing in your underwear, go ahead on the video web site! Let us see it and expect the comments to fly... Well, maybe not in your underwear... :)

In regards to jonrpick, our numbers on this forum and your truck forum are very small.... the 50K - 100K member forums are another story.

Everything you mention that makes a community on the truck forum are happening here daily.

In regards to traffic that comparison really can't be made, it is more sophisticated then that. Hits, unique visitors, bounce rate are all indicators of a web sites relevance to search engines and rankings.

Read the post about the main vintage drum guide I mention and understand that the forum is connected to the worlds largest web site about vintage drums. That is pure content! Well over 1000 pages of history and 10,000 images for people to learn from.

So in the end, TommyP said it correctly, this is a place to do all of that, just spend some time looking around and digging deeper in the history of the forum.

Many new members are coming in just at the point where changes are being made and in time they will catch up to what is going on and hopefully understand it is all for the benefit of the history of vintage drums.

Hang in there everyone, it is going to be OK!

David