Your photos are a bit out of focus but yes, based on your description of the stamps on the hats they would be 70s.

The 18 without rivets seems 1960s given your description, but I'm not sure what you mean by the squiggle at the top of the stamp.

The 18 with rivets could be a 1950s stamp, but for me one of the deciding things is to see what sort of hammering is visible. The degree of visible hammering varies from cymbal to cymbal, but if it is a 1954 stamp it should have lots of bottom hammering and top hammering. You can scroll past the stamp pic to see the hammering on this one:

http://black.net.nz/avedis/avedis-gallery.html#1954

In that 3rd photo of yours measuring the stamp it actually looks a bit bigger than 1 1/4", maybe by another 1/16"? Note that I've gone with 1 1/4" on my site based on best current info, but best current info is severely limited and subject to change as more evidence comes to hand.

The original researcher on these (Drumaholic) doesn't give much away on the details of the 1954 stamp other than suggesting he knows of some:

from 2010: http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=16096

Zenstat,

Thanks for the response. I actually used your link to help with my attempt at identification.

The squiggle I was referring to is the feature circled in red under the 1960s stamp (1960s) header about half way down the page.

For the 18 with rivets there appears to be hammering all over the top and bottom but much fainter than the pictured cymbal from the 50s. It looks very similar to the the hammering and lathing of the the other 18".

Another feature I noticed is that the i in avedis is a lower case. Maybe that helps. Your link also mentions a larger 60s stamp but I don't see a picture? Could I have one of these?

Any recommendations for getting a good pic of the stamp? I can't seem to get a clear pic that is either to dark or has glare.

I figured you had been using my site since you had used the bit of tape to mark the tops and bottoms. I'm always cheered when people find my work useful.

Ah, the circled bit at the top in the 60s stamp pic. I'm decoding that as the s of Avedis in the Ottoman portion of the stamp. I'm actually going to replace that 60s stamp pic with a new photo where instead of a red circle I just put a red line one pixel above the top of the stamp all the way across. I realized that having the circle there keeps people from seeing some of the detail in that area, but a line just above wouldn't. The switch will be done so that the old image is still there (under the existing file name) so old links work. But if you got to the site and refresh you'll get the new version (one it is in place). Since I'm actively making updates it is worth refreshing your browser (usually ctrl-R) to get the latest version.

I haven't got a very good picture of a later 60s 1.5" tall stamp. I've got one on my 18" thin crash, but it is very poorly pressed in. This is the best photo I've been able to get:

[img]http://black.net.nz/cym2015/18-1275g-late-60s.jpg[/img]

although this was before I was putting tape on for very faint or incomplete ones. This stamp is reputed to be the same as the early 60s 1 3/8" but taller. But I haven't got lots of good samples because it's hard to trust lots of eBay sellers to even know that they need to measure accurately. For most it's just "3 does = 60s" and that's all they know...even though that has been known to be incorrect for many years now. But there wasn't a good online reference for them to know any better. *sigh*

I've got a few other 1.5" 60s stamp pictures, but not nearly as many as I'd like to get a good sampling of them to see how much variation there is in how they are pressed in. For instance, your lower case i in AVEDiS is most likely an incomplete pressing and the die has a slight low spot part way up the I. I've noticed a couple of broken lines in other stamps which seem to occur in the same place in the stamp, and that's why I started thinking like that. At first I thought I might have picked up a way to tell two different stamp eras apart, but no, just natural variation.

Anyway, the stamp pics on my site which are from my own collection (many but not all) are taken with an inexpensive Canon Powershot A580. That's now an obsolete model. The key thing is good optics and a macro setting, plus using a tripod. But that doesn't cost much.

And last, yes I don't see obvious visible hammering on the bottom of those which says "50s" to me. If you have whole cymbal pictures of the top side that would help as well.

Hope this helps. You have helped me tidy up some thoughts.

When I measure the stamp again it looks like it is a 1.5" stamp. I attached some photos of the top side of the cymbals for reference.

I think it may be time for a new camera for me. I have a tripod for it but my phone takes better pictures.

thanks for all the help

Ah. On the top sides we've got what I think of as classic 1960s machine hammering. Done with a machine like a sewing machine and the operator turning the cymbal around on a turntable, I believe. Gives that look of concentric circles and small dimples.

Like my early 1960s New Beat hats:

[img]http://black.net.nz/cym2014/60sNB-top-lathing.jpg[/img]

Also, the lathing is fairly even (distance between peaks) which is more 60s than 50s. In the 50s you often (mostly?) got bands of wider and narrower lathing. Think a vinyl record with the gaps between the songs. It appeared much less even. Like this one which has some very fine zones:

[img]http://black.net.nz/avedis/images/1954-22-5.jpg[/img]

Plus of course the quite different look to that hammering on top. Not such a fine hammer face, and not done in such obvious concentric circles.

Yes 1.5" stamp makes sense given what I'm seeing of hammering and lathing.

BTW my web site has been updated now so do a refresh when you go back. I've tried to improve some of my descriptions, so thanks for hanging on in there.

Thanks again for the help.