Only Admins can see this message.
Data Transition still in progress. Some functionality may be limited until the process is complete.
Processing Attachment, Gallery - 186.98121%

Why FIVE?

Posts: 1296 Threads: 208
Loading...

Anyone heard/know of a legitimate explanation as to why Gretsch went with 5 lugs on their 12" toms? Cost savings is the first thing that comes to mind.

Coffee Break2

Never play it the same way once.
Posted on 10 years ago
#1
Loading...

Well it seems to work for me. Ludwig did half size or Mini lugs on their 12" toms just as my current vintage downbeat has.

Maybe it was born out of profit making, maybe it was born out of R&D on incurring less mass on a smaller shell. maybe a bit of both.

My 12" Tom I'm referring to is from a 70's ball and socket type kit. Despite the chunk missing from the shell and that huge lump of metal in it's place(and despite another member on here refusing to believe me) the tom sings beautifully. I've found no issue in tuning range or balance. The 3 toms on the kit match in tone perfectly.

40's Slingerland Radio King WMP
60's Ludwig Downbeat Silver Spark
70's Ludwig Super Classic White Marine
60's Gretsch RB Champaigne Spark
70's Rogers Big R Black
90's Sonor Hilite (Red maple)
00's DW Collectors Broken Glass
00's DW Jazz Series Tangerine Glass
10's DW Collectors (Acrylic) Matt Black Wrap
10's PDP Concept Wood Hoop kit (Maple)
Proud ambassador of the British Drum Company
Posted on 10 years ago
#2
Posts: 6524 Threads: 37
Loading...

Get a three foot two inch string and lay out five lugs, then six, see which accommodates the mount and trim.

First thing came to my mind.....

It`s a drum,.....Hit It !!

.....76/#XK9207 Phonic Sound Machine D454/D-505 snares !i
Posted on 10 years ago
#3
Loading...

I would imagine the same reason they had 8 lug 22" bass drums, less lugs, less money in kit. I never liked Gretsch, had several, all had the same issues, heads too tight, hard to tune and just didn't sound right.

Posted on 10 years ago
#4
Loading...

The 12" tom looks crowded with six lugs.

I have always thought that it was cheap but once I got a double tom set with 12" and 13" toms it just looks right.

Ludwigs 12" with mini classics looks funny to me when on a Hollywood set.

And what about Ludwigs 10x14 with 6 lugs but the 13x14 tom has 10!?!

Another thing is that more hardware on those thin shells with the reverse bearing edge might have choked the small tom.

Btw the Gretsch 10" Tom with die cast hoops has 5 lugs while the early 10" Tom with triple flanged hoops has 6 lugs.

1 attachment
112.6 kB
I like Drums...
1963 Ludwig Downbeat Champagne Sparkle
1964 Leedy (Slingerland) Blue n Silver Duco
1964 Ludwig Club Date Sparkling Silver Pearl
1966 Ludwig Super Classic Sparkling Silver Pearl
1968 Gretsch round badge modern jazz orange stain
1972 Slingerland 85N Pop outfit Light Blue Pearl
1976 Ludwig Vistalite clear
1981 Gretsch SSB Gran Prix Rosewood
1987 Yamaha Turbo Tour Custom Mellow Yellow
1991 Pearl Export Ferrari Red
Posted on 10 years ago
#5
Posts: 2753 Threads: 132
Loading...

Gretsch 8x12 toms with five lugs have always reminded me of cheapo Asian firewood drums. Six lugs on a Gretsch 8x12 tom would not look any more crowded than on a Ludwig or Slingerland or a Tama or Yamaha, etc. tom of the same size. It's all matter of how an individual's mind looks at it--not that person's eyes.

No matter how far you push the envelope, it is still stationery.
Posted on 10 years ago
#6
Posts: 1296 Threads: 208
Loading...

From geckobeats

My 12" Tom I'm referring to is from a 70's ball and socket type kit. Despite the chunk missing from the shell and that huge lump of metal in it's place ... the tom sings beautifully. I've found no issue in tuning range or balance.

I've got a '79 set with the same tom holder on/in it's 8x12, great sounding drum as well. You might be surprised to know that "huge lump of metal" actually weighs slightly less than a YAMAHA pre-YESS tom mount.

Never play it the same way once.
Posted on 10 years ago
#7
Loading...

This looks to be turning into a gretsch bashing.

I Love, (yes love) my ludwig drums but my Gretsch drums are far superior, the tuning range is much better.

It's also worth noting that all of the big japanese drum companies flat out copied Gretsch drums for their "vintage" lines.

Yamaha 8000 and 9000 series drums

Pearl Masters series

TAMA Starclassic

All look like Gretsch sets.

I like Drums...
1963 Ludwig Downbeat Champagne Sparkle
1964 Leedy (Slingerland) Blue n Silver Duco
1964 Ludwig Club Date Sparkling Silver Pearl
1966 Ludwig Super Classic Sparkling Silver Pearl
1968 Gretsch round badge modern jazz orange stain
1972 Slingerland 85N Pop outfit Light Blue Pearl
1976 Ludwig Vistalite clear
1981 Gretsch SSB Gran Prix Rosewood
1987 Yamaha Turbo Tour Custom Mellow Yellow
1991 Pearl Export Ferrari Red
Posted on 10 years ago
#8
Posts: 2753 Threads: 132
Loading...

I'm not bashing vintage Gretsch drums. I owned and played them when they were new. I simply don't prefer them over or like them as much as the vintage Rogers, Camco, and Slingerland drums that I also owned and played when they were new.

No matter how far you push the envelope, it is still stationery.
Posted on 10 years ago
#9
Posts: 2010 Threads: 19
Loading...

They didn't "go to five lugs"... they always were five lugs from the beginning. Other drum companies (WFL for one) also used the 5 lug setup but eventually stepped up to six. Gretsch never changed. Once they introduced their die cast hoops they were pretty well locked into keeping the 5 lug setup because casting dies were very expensive to replace. Eventually it just became one of those Gretsch traditions (like the silver sealer) and they've stuck with it even though they've probably retooled the dies several times by now.

I've never had any trouble tuning a 12" Gretsch tom despite the odd number of lugs.

There were also some 5 lug 13" toms back in the day.

When Gretsch first introduced smaller toms in the 70's they used off the shelf six hole triple flange hoops for a few years until they decided to spend the dough for casting dies for hoops in those sizes too, at that point they reverted to 5 lug designs on the 8 and 10 (6" has 4).

Posted on 10 years ago
#10
  • Share
  • Report
Action Another action Something else here