Just picked up a Zildjian at a pawn shop for $50. 16" crash I think. Yeah the deals are out there.

Being a Paiste guy, my first thought was 602's...but if I had to start over at this point & time looking vintage, the last thing I'd buy would be Zildjians! Unlike Paiste, Sabian & even Minle...everything the Big Z has produced below their top tier K's is absolute crap & has been for a long time! If I was going to start over with a vintage vibe in mind, it would be with Bosporous. I've never played anything this company has made that was even close to being mediocre! Yes, they're a bit pricey, but some of the best plates I've ever played! Unlike Zildjian, Sabian & even Paiste, they don't turn out the rolled/pressed/machined lower line garbage these guys are doing. After that, I'd go with real Turkish Hand Hammered Cymbals, you can get in to these for less money, but you have to go thru a stack of them to get some good ones.

If you've got the cash, here's my personal picks. (in no specific order)

• Paiste Traditionals - expensive as hell, but you get what you pay for

• Bosporous - they're all great

• Turkish - bunch of companies out there to choose from, most have good stuff

• Sabian HH - next to last resort

• Zildjian K - last resort

Bottom line, several years back, Sabian passed Zildjian to be the second to last place crapola cymbal maker! Every once in a while the BIG Z will actually make something worth a $hit, but those go to their endorsers or in the rep bags...I wouldn't saddle down a broke dick dog with any of their crap!

Just my 2 cents!

These are my opinion & free of charge!...if you don't like it, sorry! you get what you pay for! (tribute to my buddy Dennis Stauffer...RIP Dennis!)

Fungus, we damned near agree on everything. And I even agree with you on a good vintage sounding Paiste. But from a budgetary standpoint, even lower end Paistes are pies you can't go wrong with.

Yes, I have to say that I'd rather play Paiste Alphas than almost any Zildjian!!! Alphas are the best deal out there; however, the new PST8 series could be the sleeper line in Paiste's line up. Slotted in right between the Alphas and PST5 (which are not terrible cymbals), these have the hand-finished Reflector finish.

It all comes down to ears, I realise.

My Two.....

If you hit cymbal on the pie,..you don`t wanna hear bell, if you hear bell on the flat, don`t get it. You wanna hear bell only when you hit bell !!

Does cussing do something for your self esteem? Come on guys, tame it down. That post was clear enough without it. Remember, it's not just a social gathering of drinking buddies. It's a drum history site. Thanks.

Thanks for the replies. Fungus, while your reply was on the earthy side, I see what your saying. I appreciate the honesty even if it is earthy thats good. Are the PST8 cymbals out yet. Oddball, I'll keep that in mind. Yeah rogersling- I hear ya. What suggestions do you have.

I don't believe the PST8 are out, yet. I am thinking they should be in the stores soon.

Do you like the Zildjian you bought from the pawn shoppe? $50 is a stonking deal if you like the sound.

BEAUTIFUL compromise!!! Thank you, big guy.

There are numerous threads that deal with very nice cymbals on the cheap. I have found several Dream cymbals that are amazing. I've also found some older Zildjian A's that are slick. I love an old HH Sabian. Bos and Isty are AMAZING cymbals (as Fugus wisely pointed out). The Paiste Trads are some of the best I've EVER played, but they do come with a price.

I have played very few old Zildjian K's that I thought sounded good. I don't have the ear that a lot of these mooks have ... obviously. I know a good cymbal when I hear it, but I gotta tell ya, most of those old K's sound like garbage to me. Chunky, clangy, non-responsive, and dry ... not what I'm looking for in a cymbal. The one's that I've dug were thinner and VERY responsive and way more crash-like than ride-like.

So, not sure if I'm the best to ask about cymbals. I definitely don't fit the average mold.

But would cracking good deal be a good substitute?