That cymbal looks like an A Zildjian to me. Given the lathing style I'd say early 60s, but it's always tricky when there isn't any trademark info to confirm lathing based observations. Bell lathing changes from the 50s to the 60s. In the 1950s style you can see several obvious separate passes so the bell ends up with some fine tonal groove and some more coarse tonal groove in varying proportions. By the 60s bells are more coarse tonal groove, although the bow of the cymbal is often still a bit variable in width of the grooves. By the 70s the lathing tends to be more even on the bell and the bow. Note that these decade descriptions are not meant to suggest that lathing changed dramatically on December 31st at the end of each decade. The differences observed (when you correlate them with trademark stamps) represent changes in the frequency with which you find different sorts of lathing styles.

My gallery of bell lathing styles: http://black.net.nz/avedis/bells.html

The "stepped" lathing on the bottom is a bit different from the Italian style "stepped" lathing in that the Italian style tends to have fine tonal grooves versus that one which has more variable grooves. I've seen video of lathing happening in the UFiP factory and you can see how the lathing is done in discrete bands with the tool pulled back in between. Similarly you can see pauses in the videos of Avedis Zildjian lathing, but they don't tend to be as extreme.

The other thing which can help with the identification of Avedis Zildjian cymbals versus Italian sourced ones is the treatment of the area close to the mounting hole, and the patterns of lathe chatter. Again yours looks more Avedis Zildjian 60s to me than Italian on both counts. The other thing which can help spot Italian cymbals is that they are metric. However, that doesn't help with a 13" cymbal because it just happens that the metric equivalent is 330mm which is so close you aren't likely to pick up a difference.

There are a small proportion of A Zildjian cymbals which escape the factory without a trademark stamp. In my database of about 2000 cymbals the percentage is running about 0.3% (3 in 1000). So why do some not have a trademark? The likely causes are (in no particular order)

[LIST]

[*]somebody neglected to carry out that step in the factory

[*]it is a second but didn't get an S stamped in, or any other markings

[*]the pressing machine was adjusted to be so light that the impression is almost impossible to see

[/LIST]

Wow....I really appreciate your knowledge/info! As in the past, I knew you would be very helpful. I thought it was a vintage Zildjian but I had never seen one without any stamping at all. I got this cymbal online ($30) and it was labeled as a "miscellaneous" cymbal because of the lack of stamp or marking. Thanks again for the help! I plan to pair this with a 13" A custom bottom I just ordered...hoping it sounds good as a pair.

I also have a very nice 20" mystery ride that I'm convinced is an unstamped Zildjian, most likely a 60's. It sounds fine. I bought it for a song from an elderly gent who was a drummer and was selling all his gear.

Hey Drum Bob,

Must have been a plague of those unmarked Zildjians at one time here in NJ as I've got one too that I picked up from a craiglister in S. Plainfield. Have a mix of Paiste 602's, but mostly Zildjians that were part of the 67 BOP Downbeat kit that I bought from my drum teacher in the early 70's, so I am familiar with how the older Zildjians look. The unmarked Zildjian look alike that I have is a 16", so been using as a crash, but it's a bit heavy. Quite a lineup of drums you've got there. In addition to my 67 kit, I've got a 90's Premier Signia kit that I'm quite fond of. Nice to know I'm in good company here in snowy NW NJ!