Wow. I didn’t realize they were inking the cymbals that early. Just learned something.

One area of “ink research” I have done, which seems to bear out is with the AMERICAN K line. The “hype” on the so called “early American K” is valid in my opinion, and they are something I seek out these days. But the ink can give excellent insight into these if you pay attention.

I have divided them into generations for my own head. Please feel free to contribute or correct as needed.

Gen I ( the good stuff- hand hammered)

These show a “strobe” K on top and bottom. No large Zildjian ink. Also the size/type ink on top is “upside down” compared to the A’s of the same era (1980-83/5?)-

Gen II (not bad- hand and machine hammering)

I believe more machine hammering was being done at this point. Not quite as “special” As Gen I to me but some real gems can be found when you can play them in person. Now the underside has the large Zildjian ink rather than the strobe K. Top looks the same as Gen I.

Gen III (machine hammered)

These, like production A’s of the era (mid to late 80’s?) can have some real dogs. Hand selection in person is the only way to go with these. Top ink changed with “right side up” size/type stamp, just like A’s of the same era. Large Zildjian ink on the bottom. Basically a darker 80’s A. I would not be surprised to find they all are made the same at this time and then stamped and inked after the final product is played...

Edited to add Gen IV, which is when they started sealizing the in the 90’s. I think they lost the plot at this point. Only the KnCustom lines are worth looking into. I REALLY tried to like the production K’s of the 90’s-up but they are clanky and gongy to me. I found some in-loved KnCustom Dark 13” hats and they are awesome. I then found an 18” Crash to match. Any smaller crash in this line sounds like, well, sounds bad. 20” ride in this line is good; the 22” is a pig... strange but true to my ears.

Side note: k custom session crash is awesome if you are not ready to “fully commit” to the dark side... I have an 18 crash that notches perfectly between my 18” A and 18” k custom dark crash... the gateway cymbal. (Developed with Steve Gadd I believe)

Here's my work on the North American Ks (including the Canadian Ks) which examines several of the often mentioned beliefs including: the importance of hand hammering in overall production process, model ink upside down as an indicator of age, EAKs started before 1980 (it was 1982 based on some pretty solid evidence). I'd be happy to incorporate your evidence on these matters in a revision if needed:

http://black.net.nz/avedis/NAK.html

I've got a lot more work to do on the later eras to pin down some of the changes in ink and lathing, and a lot of detail I haven't yet added on models, their years of production, and weights. It's a work in progress. And as part of that the text doesn't yet reflect that I've seen one or two more EAKs which don't have the diameter ink under the model ink. I had only found one such cymbal when I last updated the history. If you have any examples of EAKs with model ink but no diameter ink I'd love to see pictures of them.

I only have one (gen I) EAK now, and I lucked into it. I love it. Buttery, very dynamic and musical. 17” but you can ride it- probably more so with a light 7A or something (but I manage it with oak 5A’s) lots of edge wobble. It’s “alive” and I really appreciate that.

It has the diameter along with “dark crash” designation. I have never seen one without the diameter stamped on it, but (one theory) is that’s a “Gen 0” pre-production model? And note I was 10/11 in 1980 but I remember the ads with Tony williams in Modern drummer showing the new k’s... it may have been ‘83 as you indicate but I have also heard it was as early a ‘79.

I believe they got too popular and they just couldn’t make enough of them by hand.

I’d say 82 is the official start year based on that bag... hard to argue that.

Mine (17”) must be from ‘84. It has the stamp at 3 (or 9) o’clock too. I forgot about that. A’s have the stamp at 12 o’clock. Since my first hand experience was with A’s that struck me as odd when I first saw it.

I think I sent you pictures of it already, and the price I paid was artificially low, so not good for you statistics.

Interesting stuff.

Hey Zenstat. Good to hear from you. (See below) - Catalog is actually dated on the front 1963-64. I'll have to dig to see where I got the file from.

Pete

edit - saw your link. Yep, that's where I got it from.

Thanks so much for the detailed response. I'll attempt to get you those photo's. However, both the hollow Zildjian under cymbal label and the top stamp are very light. My Ebay seller alleges to be the original owner of the cymbal, and I believe described it as 70's, so that would seem to support your conclusion of the ink stamp starting around 78. Once I figure out how to post pics - I may send you one of what looks to be a Trans Stamp Zildjian that I got with my 1967 BOP Downbeat kit in the early 70's to see what you can tell me about it - if you're so inclined! My drum teacher at the time was an older Jazz drummer, and sold me the almost new kit with some older Zildjians that I've often wondered if they are back to the 40's or 50's. Thanks again.