I'm curious what internet sources indicate Joe Morello used 602 Sound Edge hats. Did it come from Cymbal Wiki and thus the Paiste Profiles?

http://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Joe_Morello

Or is it a different source we can add to the Wiki? We are still reconstructing all the lost info from the original P-O wiki. I can vouch for the Joe Morello series hats not being Sound Edge. But one of the pair was a slightly smaller diameter as per Joe's specs. I've got photos and details to show that. What I don't know is why the wiki says what it says. I might have to ask around the rest of the group doing the reconstruction and see if we have copies of those Profiles books to double check. I also have a vague memory of a Joe Morello 602 ad which might be for Sound Edge hats but I'll have to go looking on my disk. So Joe might have been using SE hats before the hats in his Joe Morello series were finalized.

As to the set, yes to the diameters you have, although I'm not sure that the 17" an 18" actually had model ink saying THIN CRASH and CRASH RIDE. The 17" weighs around 1200-1300g and the 18" around 1450g-1550g but data is scarce. The reconstructed wiki has a pdf you can download with weights.

http://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Weight_Table

I haven't got around to getting the table back into wiki format and I also haven't added all the data we've collected since that was done. Based on what is there the 17" could be a PAPER THIN or a THIN or a THIN CRASH in terms of weights. But there is more to these models than just weight. The 18" Joe Morello is closer to the THIN or THIN CRASH weight than a MEDIUM (which is Paiste-speak for CRASH RIDE in the Fo602 series). I have a lot more data than made it into that pdf, but I haven't had time to go through it all and produce an updated analysis. What I have done is started to add both pricing info and weight info into the individual model records. For example:

http://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Traditionals_22%22_Light_Ride

but I haven't made it to all the 602 records yet.

All the cymbals of the Joe Morello set have the fine tonal groove lathing. They share this property with Fo602 flat rides, Sound Edge hats, and the Seven Sound Set cymbals. Opinions vary a bit about the sonic difference of fine tonal groove lathing vs the deeper tonal groove lathing of the rest of the Fo602. All I know at this point is that the choice of fine tonal groove lathing was by design.

I haven't yet done the analysis of prices for these. I've got 19 sales of Morello series cymbals (counting hats a one) vs thousands of Fo602 sales so I really want to do a proper analysis of prices of other 17" and 18" cymbals (including main line vs Seen Sound Set and Morello) to give more context. Are you also thinking of selling a 20" Morello ride? Do I need to include that analysis as well? I might take a day or two of work to do this.

I currently have two other pieces of analysis work to do before I can get to yours. You can see why it is taking a long time to get the wiki back to the level I would like.

Thank you for your help.

[IMG]https://s19.directupload.net/images/200109/fyi6dkq5.jpg[/IMG]

Yes, information was from wiki/Paiste profiles.

Weights you gave fit, cymbals are from 74/75 (sizes 14,17,18,20). Pre-owner said they were bought as a "set" when new, the Sound Edge hats are serial number matched to the ride cymbal by two or three digits. Would be interested in a set value guesstimate and for the three Morellos each. Additionally, for script logo hats, if I ever come across (but that can wait of course for the wiki); been trading SE hats a couple of times, so know vaguely about their value, also what to expect for "normal" 602 cymbals, also thank you for your value chart - has been quite helpful in the past. Any help appreciated, but don't want to cause any inconvenience, of course.

Best,

F

Hi F,

just out of curiosity, do the sound edge hats have the additional Morello stamping like the other cymbals in the set? Or are they stamped like a basic pair of SE hats?

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Zen,

As for the SE/non-SE thing in regards to the Morello set here is what I can glean from the old Paiste catalogs:

the original preserial Morello set indeed had hats that were exclusive to the Morello set - made to Joe's specs.

At some point by 1974, the original Morello hats got replaced by the SE Hats for the rest of the production run until 77/78.

Why, I can't say - maybe at some point Joe switched to sound edge in the early 70s would be my best guess.