Just for a bit of fun really. I was wondering what kit's/Snares from todays makers will hit true vintage status in 40-50 years time. Will DW Jazz series kits pull through. Tama Bubbinga's maybe? Craviotto Solid shell? Will any of the new glut of custom builders make the fold?
I'm interested to see what you guy's make of it.
The special offerings from Ludwig. Craviottos. Maybe some Tama, and Pearl Signatures... excluding the low end examples such the Jordison. Ayotte is a flash in the pan, which is a shame. The myriad of custom makers will disappear into the abyss without memory, most will get painted whatever is the new black by the sons and grandsons of the idiots who bought them. No vented. DW will probably be there somewhere.
I honestly don't see any deep and meaningful value in the drums. There was no VINTAGE vibe during the 40s, 50s, 60s, or 70s. I'm speaking en masse. It wasn't until the late 80s and 90s before it hit fairly big. Now, it's become a joke. Every spoon billed gull jockey believes they can make a mint on anything that could be connected to the drums during those time periods.
The proof is everywhere you care to glance.
Numbered COLLECTIBLE snares, Retro Wraps, Rereleased cymbals, Vintage Modern Kits, blah blah blah. Not to mention Marvin and Helgas Vintage eBay store run out of their trailer shed. What a crock.
Once the product is defined for the society, redefining is not an option. An entirely new market must be developed.
Vintage Drums has been defined. That's pretty much that. Oh sure, there will always be the fringe explorers, but by and large, it's done. There will not be a 90s vintage kit bidding war and collectable game for the vast majority of us. Those drums are out of bounds for our little game.
There will always be a market for well built instruments. But, that's a different set of rules.
Numbered COLLECTIBLE snares, Retro Wraps, Rereleased cymbals, Vintage Modern Kits, blah blah blah. .........What a crock.
Both G.C.s within a half hour of my house have those "# ____ of 250" Ludwig snares, the 100th anniversary pink oyster swirl or whatever it is. This is a perfect example of a useless attempt at creating a collectible snare. Not even the feeble-minded people who shop at G.C. buy them. Seriously.
On a related note, I DID see one of those drums *trying* to sell on eBay for $650. DOH I watched it, thinking that if it ACTUALLY SOLD, I'd run right down to G.C. with $380 in hand. Guess who still has that $380?
Oh, and I LOVE the fact that DWs main line is called "Collector's Series". BAAHAAAHAA!!!
Both G.C.s within a half hour of my house have those "# ____ of 250" Ludwig snares, the 100th anniversary pink oyster swirl or whatever it is. This is a perfect example of a useless attempt at creating a collectible snare. Not even the feeble-minded people who shop at G.C. buy them. Seriously.On a related note, I DID see one of those drums *trying* to sell on eBay for $650. DOH I watched it, thinking that if it ACTUALLY SOLD, I'd run right down to G.C. with $380 in hand. Guess who still has that $380?Oh, and I LOVE the fact that DWs main line is called "Collector's Series". BAAHAAAHAA!!!
Great post. Great quote. I agree 100%
I honestly don't see any deep and meaningful value in the drums. There was no VINTAGE vibe during the 40s, 50s, 60s, or 70s. I'm speaking en masse. It wasn't until the late 80s and 90s before it hit fairly big. Now, it's become a joke. Every spoon billed gull jockey believes they can make a mint on anything that could be connected to the drums during those time periods. The proof is everywhere you care to glance. Numbered COLLECTIBLE snares, Retro Wraps, Rereleased cymbals, Vintage Modern Kits, blah blah blah. Not to mention Marvin and Helgas Vintage eBay store run out of their trailer shed. What a crock. Once the product is defined for the society, redefining is not an option. An entirely new market must be developed. Vintage Drums has been defined. That's pretty much that. Oh sure, there will always be the fringe explorers, but by and large, it's done. There will not be a 90s vintage kit bidding war and collectable game for the vast majority of us. Those drums are out of bounds for our little game.There will always be a market for well built instruments. But, that's a different set of rules.
I agree with you.
Yes your probably right. Some of the stuff they make today is far to contrived.
But I will say this. Around 10 years ago I bought an early 70's B/O badge Super Classic. That would of put that kit in the 30 year age group. I can remember the prices on those badges (as with Gretsch SS badges) being low. Early Ebay memories serve that people couldn't give them away. I bought mine for £400($200 US at the time). Best £400 I've spent. It now seems the tide has come in for this era of Drums as they have clicked over into the 40 year bracket and the prices and respect have gone up. I also notice people getting excited over clean examples of 70's Yammy 9000's and Tama Artstars/Superstars etc.
The problem with the modern stuff is that it's literally cranked out like cat food. Automation has made it to where you can put out hundreds per day rather than twenty per day.
I agree with sentiment pertaining to all of this "collectable" crap- if it were truly collectable, nobody would know it until AFTER production ceases, and it's usually YEARS after. Example: Four years of regular production of Paiste Colorsound cymbals made them collectable (to a point); but then again- if you're willing to plunk down 30% extra, you can get almost any cymbal in their line coloured black or white for a five month wait. But it's very hard to find an NOS or clean used blue, yellow, or green Colorsound cymbal. Reds are pretty common sight.
Usually, collectables are under appreciated whilst in production, and in many cases were sold at fire sale prices. Any item sold as a collector's piece is usually a loser as far as investments go. The Fender SRV replicas Banjo Center sold are a big example of this.
My prediction is that the small, custom builders who end up becoming household names will be selling the collector's items of today. Or, an item that was NOTABLY better before it was "improved" is usually a collector's item. But are you willing to hang onto an item long enough for it to become truly collectable?
Fellow's I hate to kick a big ole hole in your bench theory, but your bigtime wrong, here is an example starring you in the face, and I've got tons more than this one, http://cgi.ebay.com/Ludwig-Limited-Edition-Engraved-Black-Beauty-Snare-Drum-/330563087055?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf7186acf I had a craviotto oak Limited edition, bought it for $350.00 sold it for $950.00 to a well know vintage collector, who even stated this is money in the bank. have you priced an early Brady snare drum lately? other examples, Noble Cooley Zildjian snare drum's, Paiste Spirit of 2002 snare drums, craviotto lake superior snare drums, I could keep this up for quite awhile. price any of these purchase price with the price you'll pay now??
None of these are vintage, as was the OPs initial question. These are just quality instruments selling for good money. Will they CONTINUE to increase in value, as the initial investors have gambled? Who knows? My guess...no. Not to the degree that is so obviously hoped. It's a good short term investment, but a lousy long term gamble.
