The first and second cymbals both look Italian. The first one on the basis of the bands in the lathing. This illustration marks the bands with blue arrows pointing to the distinct sections so you hopefully see what I see:

[img]http://black.net.nz/cym2014/ItalianLathing.jpg[/img]

The second one appears in the stencil brands which UFiP says they produced over the years. Top row forth over from left, and fourth row third over from the left. Both have red circles around them. Yours combines stylistic elements from both of the Feltium (or whatever it says) examples.

The Italians used a lot of "Turkish" stylistic like the crescent moon and star, and the word constantinople, and the pseudo Arabic script, to give the notion that these Italian cymbals were of Turkish origin. It looks to me like it is from an earlier generation than the first one (on the basis of hammering style). That's independent of it having 1947 stamped on it near the edge...which gives a nice date for this style.

[img]http://black.net.nz/cym2012/ufipStencilBrands.jpg[/img]

what zenstat said. Not to be mistaken for old K Zildjian Constantinople, but definitely a good find. I've always wanted one like this as a bottom Hi Hat. I think these cymbals look similar to Bellotti cymbals in the way they're hammered.

This Bellotti Cymbals thing is a bit of a mystery to me. I've seen claims that

it was the name of a USA drum shop owner Sergio Bellotti and they were UFiP sourced cymbals made for him

it was a separate company in Italy

it was a UFiP stencil brand

the cymbals can be recognized by a certain characteristic hammering (yet usually not accompanied by a photo to show what is meant)

I found a stamp photo

[img]http://black.net.nz/cym2014/bellotti.jpg[/img]

Wikipedia has a tiny entry (which happily includes a photo of the distinctive hammering):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cymbal_manufacturers#Bellotti_Cymbals

Yet Bellotti doesn't appear in either of my main reference works for Italian cymbals:

Hugo Pinksterboer, The Cymbal Book

Luca Luciano, Italian Vintage drums and cymbals

How can they not appear in the major research works, yet we find a few around?

@Zenstat, Well can`t say enough thanks for everything You explained, wonderul. Thanks.

That is exactly the hammering I am seeing here.

What do you think what would be the best use for first two cymbals? rides....?

@Chromeo, take a look at our adds:

http://www.kupujemprodajem.com/Bubnjevi-Cinele-22-1168-1-grupa.htm

I got both cymbals, dixon hi hat stand and pedal (without Meinl``\s) for 15 eur..:) on the flea Market....

A week ago I found a guy selling Ludwig spur lok hi hat stand without clutch and cymbals for 5 eur:) on a different flea market...If I can do anything from here, let me know.

Good find Marcello. I am in the same boat with this flat ride I recently acquired. Anyone have any idea the name of the "HP" stencil that I highlighted in Blue?

[IMG]http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y231/Sgtpepper89L/ufipStencilBrands_zps2ce2597e.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y231/Sgtpepper89L/photo2-2_zpsdb43fa73.jpg[/IMG]

@GiantBeater...Did find any info on your cymbal so far?

Hey, yes! Someone on another forum recognized the HiP ink stamp as the elusive Hi Percussion company from the late 70's. My flat ride is in fact B8 and might be rare because I can't seem to find anything online that details anything about the company's cymbals. Sounds great though and SO charlie watts. Low, dry, and when the guitars and PA are on, the tone cuts right though but sits under the vocals. I am waiting for a similar ride but an 18''. The HiP cymbal I have now says it is 20'' but is closer to 19''. Thanks all and I will check back in because I have a lead on another Charlie Watts Italian type flat but this one is a true 18''.

Heh, thats a keeper :))))) great....Bowing..

ps. I miss Chicago so much, I spent 2 months there, and then a year in Ca, SFrancisco, and 3 more months in Florida. Chicago was, so to say, like home;)

I made a quick sound file of my flat ride, check it out if you can! Ahhhh Marcello, Chicago can be wonderful but the winter creeps up on us faster and faster each year!

https://soundcloud.com/7levelsstudios/vintage-italian-hipercussion-flat-ride