I found these in a pawnshop sometime ago, a good bud of mine this guy is 6'9" tall and plays a 30" bass drum, he is a much harder player than I so he knew not to get the cymbals so he called and told me about them, I go to the pawnshop,I have a good relationship with elmer the owner, I ask him about the hats, he points to a pile of junk, they are mounted to an old impoet stand, laying sideways on the pile of junk with more junk piled on top of it?? I ask elmer what will he take for the cymbal HERE'S THE BAD PART THE TOP CYMBAL IS CRACKED 2" FROM THE MOUNTING HOLE ON BOTH SIDES! He tells me $20.00. the hihat clutch was rusted to the top cymbal, I tols elmer,He could have the stand back after,I got the clutch oof the cymbal 2 days later,I return the stand, to elmer for him to sell it to someone,!!! bill has already dated the hats for me ,,thank you!!! this is my 3rd pair, i'll keep these!Keep on Pl