Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Hey Everyone,

New to this forum and I have a question. I own 2 thirds of what appears to be a 1964 Ludwig Downbeat kit (floor tom 14, bass drum 20, both numbered in the 60000s). They are both in pretty good shape, with perhaps the exception of the bass drum hoops which are a tad rough. I'm of course missing the 12" rack tom w/ the appropriate mounting hardware. Also for whatever reason, the tension rods and hoop for the floor tom resonant head are missing. I'm looking to sell these, as I just picked up a 70s Slingerland kit, and the basement is starting to get crowded ha ha. Anyways I'm wondering if it's even worth it to try to complete/restore the Ludwig kit. What would be the best way to track down that rack tom? So far, the obvious avenues (eBay etc) are yielding no luck. Any ideas? Is this even worthwhile? Would really appreciate some input on this.

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

An important question is what color/wrap are they? That can make a huge difference in either the value if you sell or the difficulty/ease in locating the missing 12" tom to complete the set. If it's a rare color it may take a long search to find the tom but conversely what you do have will likely be worth more. If it's an easy to find finish then finding the small tom should be relatively easy but the set itself won't be worth as much.

12/14/20 sets tend to be desired so no matter what the finish there is value there if things aren't trashed (bass drums hoops generally aren't a big deal, easy to refinish/replace) . 14" floor toms are always being hunted for so they tend to be the most sought after and valuable part of these kits.

Post additional info and photos and we might be able to give you more solid options towards either route.

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Yes hang on to them and hunt them down. The 20/14/12 setup will be highly desired no matter what the trends are. A classic setup.

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

I agree with the above. The color/wrap does make a big deal. I would think it might be easier to find someone looking for those pieces then to find a tom just to get rid of it.
Why buy to sell again. But then again I don't think any drum is garbage.

Wayne

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Eddie,

First, Welcome to the forum.! If your basement's getting crowded with vintage drums, where have you been? This is the forum for vintage drum talk, questions, advice, selling, buying, and trading. Nice to have you join us.

We like pictures! (If you have any trouble attaching pictures using the little paper clip attachment tool, we'll help you). Hard to give advice without seeing what you're starting with. But I don't think any drums are beyond restoration. Just depends how much $$$ you want to invest. I had some ugly, junky Ludwig orphans that turned out pretty....

Attachment 107621

I'm sure your bass and 14" FT would look great as a full set. A member here might already have the tom you're looking for.

Pictures, pictures, pictures! Jumping2

Mike

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Are there any date stamps in either drum?

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Hold on to those babies like they were the last drums you'll ever own.
The Downbeat configuration is possibly the most sought after right now for two reasons. The desirable and versatile smaller sizes, and the elusive 4x14 snare drum. Yours is almost complete, and if and when you decide to go for completion, you may be lucky enough to snag up a snare drum in that same finish one day if you're into the hunting aspect.. I like to go on Reverb.com, and Chicago music exchange to check out vintage drum gear for fun( live in Montreal, Quebec, Canada), and i see a lot of beauties up for sale on those sites.. Please show us some pics, and let us know what you're decision will be !

https://reverb.com/ca/marketplace/dr...&year_min=1800

https://www.chicagomusicexchange.com.../drums/vintage

Cheers,
Rob

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Sorry about the wait. I don't use these interwebs so much. Hope the pics show up. Thanks for all the replies.

The drums are black cortex wrap. I have not been able to locate any date stamps. The kick head may be original. I never changed it. I originally included the serial no.s because they seemed a bit odd to me (60000). Depending on which resource you consult, this number either exists or it doesn't. I bought these drums as part of an odds and ends kit back in 1994. The seller completed it with some Westbury rack toms and mish-mashed cymbals/stands. It was actually my very first kit.

Wayne is totally right. The word "garbage" is a tad harsh, and only refers to monetary value in this case. In reality, I got a lot of enjoyment out of those drums. I have a basement recording studio, and I've recorded that floor tom recently. That explains the newer Evans head.

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Something tells me that the cortex wrap may not be original. I don't think Ludwig used cortex wraps until the mid to late 70's, and because the drums have keystone badges, that would indicate 60's drums. Did you check to see if there was anything underneath the wrap ? Possibly an original wrap ?

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Are you sure they are cortex? Cortex wraps were a formica type laminate that debuted in the early 70s. There were black drums earlier, either black lacquer over a outer maple ply, or regular gloss black wrap. Either of those would be a better fit to your timeline.

60,000 serial # correlates to approx. 1968/69 (none of the online data bases is anywhere close to accurate but Rick Gier's book on the subject is).

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

I'm actually a bit confused about it. In my original post, I thought the drums were lacquer. However I thought maybe it was not lacquer for a few reasons. 1) The finish didn't seem to have much gloss to it, and 2) There is a really noticeable seam on the floor tom, which I thought was indicative of a wrap. I might be wrong on both counts. One of the reasons that I joined this forum, is that I never really payed a lot of attention to this stuff before, and my knowledge of vintage drums has been cobbled together from things I've seen on the net. So I fully admit that I'm late to the party. Is there another explanation for that seam?

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

Just read K.O.'s post. That might clear things up for me a bit.

Re: Possibly Good, Maybe Garbage? 1964 Ludwig Kit
 

There would be a visible seam for either finish. In the case of lacquer you'd be able to see the seam where the wood of the shell laps into itself. The outside of a vintage Ludwig 3 ply shell isn't perfectly smooth all around like a modern shell, you can see/feel a vertical seam in the wood. Also the lacquer finishes were not super glossy like on modern drums.

Look at the edge of a shell and it should be apparent whether it's a layer of plastic wrap on top of the wood of just a layer of paint on the outside ply. If it is a wrapped drum (depending on when it was made) the wrap will go into the scarf joint where the two ends of the plywood overlap (the wrap was put on the plywood before it was bent into a shell up until roughly 1968).