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1968 Kit in Mahogany stain - Mahogany shells or Maple?

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I have recently purchased a 1968 Ludwig kit that consists of a 24" kick, 13" Rack Tom and a 16" Floor Tom. Both toms feature the 'baseball bat' type mufflers, all drums have white interiors and their badges have serial numbers that range between 563*** and 565*** which according to the Ludwig website places them in 1968 and the 13" tom has an ink stamp on the inside of its shell, JAN-51968.

Now from what I understand, the baseball bat style mufflers came to an end in 1968 and the internal finish of the shells went from white to natural finish during 1968 so Im guessing that this kit was one of the last of this era before these new changes came in which also coincided with when shell construction started to shift from Mahogany/Popular/Mahogany to Maple/Popular/Maple. Therefore, I'm guessing that it could be possible that the shells of my kit may be of different woods, some being Mahogany and another being Maple?

The reason I ask is that the kit is finished in a mahogany stain but the 13" tom is of a darker shade than the floor tom and kick drum and also seems to be slightly smoother with less grain. I see no evidence of the badges having ever been removed at any point so assume that this is the original factory stain but curious as to why there is a slight difference in the colour of the 13" tom and wondered if perhaps this could be due to the staining process having been applied to a different wood?

I'm interested to know what other here think and I will try and get some photos of the shells posted in the coming days.

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Posted on 4 years ago
#1
Posts: 2010 Threads: 19
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Natural mahogany finished 3 ply drums generally have an actual mahogany exterior. The fat center ply that makes up the bulk of the shell is poplar. If you have white interiors then the interior ply is probably mahogany but might be maple. The white paint allowed them to mix and match based on what wood they had on hand on a given day.

With Ludwig really nothing is set in stone, they'd do whatever it took to keep drums rolling out the factory door. It's possible they might have stained a drum with a maple exterior to match mahogany drums but much more likely that they are all mahogany exteriors and that the color difference can be attributed to variations in the wood plies and the filling and staining process. There is quite a bit of potential for variation in the staining process. A drum done by a different worker or on a different day might come out a bit different.

Another possibility might be a different level of fading due to the passage of time or exposure to UV light or heat.

Sounds like a cool set. Natural mahogany finish sets seem to be something of a rarity outside of Jazzette sized sets. Post some pictures.

Posted on 4 years ago
#2
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Thanks for the reply K.O and for sharing your thoughts on the subject, much appreciated. Having had a closer look at where the shells have had a little scuff exposing the wood underneath, it does appear that all 3 shells may be of mahogany exterior. However, the rack tom is certainly smoother and unlike the floor tom and kick drum, you can't really feel the grain on it. It is this rack tom that is of a darker shade, more brown and less of the reddish tone that the other 2 shells have. I shall get some photos posted here soon, be keen to know what you think.

www.backwaterchannels.com
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Posted on 4 years ago
#3
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Here are a few photos I have quickly taken of the kit which shows the variation in the colour and finish, I would be keen to know what the experts here think. Unfortunately the kick drum is missing its Rail Consolette but I hope to pick up a suitable replacement at some point.

www.backwaterchannels.com
www.facebook.com/backwaterchannelsstudio
Posted on 4 years ago
#4
Posts: 2753 Threads: 132
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If the color variation bothers you, a furniture refinisher or piano refinisher (pretty much the same thing) could probably make the mounted tom match the other two drums.

No matter how far you push the envelope, it is still stationery.
Posted on 4 years ago
#5
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I'm tempted to say the rack tom is an MIJ shell with Ludwig hardware - the grain seems to be running vertical. While the grommet looks un-mangled, it could be just a tick "short" - carefully shaved down on the inside to allow removal.

There's an ink stamp so I guess it's legit, but that rack tom finish bears no relation to the other shells to me eye. Maybe it's just the brushstrokes of the finish, which would definitely make it not factory.....I dunno. Your pics freaked me out. :)

Posted on 4 years ago
#6
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From leedybdp

If the color variation bothers you, a furniture refinisher or piano refinisher (pretty much the same thing) could probably make the mounted tom match the other two drums.

The colour difference doesn't really bother me too much but was curious to know if folk here think that this was the original factory stain for all the shells or if any work has been carried out further down the line. Also, what are you thoughts on the difference in the grain and finish between that rack tom and the other shells?

Should I decide to have the rack tom redone to match the other shells, could this be done without the removal of the badge?

www.backwaterchannels.com
www.facebook.com/backwaterchannelsstudio
Posted on 4 years ago
#7
Posts: 5176 Threads: 188
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From backwater channels

The colour difference doesn't really bother me too much but was curious to know if folk here think that this was the original factory stain for all the shells or if any work has been carried out further down the line. Also, what are you thoughts on the difference in the grain and finish between that rack tom and the other shells?Should I decide to have the rack tom redone to match the other shells, could this be done without the removal of the badge?

#1 Something is fishy.... This isn' the way they would have left the factory.

#2 No, you'd have to remove the badge to do a proper job. But I need to see more pics both inside and out and the bearing edges before saying more.

"God is dead." -Nietzsche

"Nietzsche is dead." -God
Posted on 4 years ago
#8
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My gut reaction is to say that those drums have been stripped and stained, but for some reason, the rack tom came out differently than the other two drums. Or, maybe a past owner added the rack tom afterwards. I'm not sure.

If they were mine, I'd have them recovered in a wrap I liked.

Posted on 4 years ago
#9
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From O-Lugs

#1 Something is fishy.... This isn' the way they would have left the factory.

From DownTownFarmer

I'm tempted to say the rack tom is an MIJ shell with Ludwig hardware - the grain seems to be running vertical. While the grommet looks un-mangled, it could be just a tick "short" - carefully shaved down on the inside to allow removal.There's an ink stamp so I guess it's legit, but that rack tom finish bears no relation to the other shells to me eye. Maybe it's just the brushstrokes of the finish, which would definitely make it not factory.....I dunno. Your pics freaked me out. :)

After closer inspection it appears that you are correct regarding the badge on the rack tom having been carefully shaved down on the inside to allow removal. So I think it's safe to say that the 13" tom has definitely been re-stained which would explain the difference in its appearance to the floor tom and kick (which I am assuming are perhaps original factory finish?)

From DrumBob

My gut reaction is to say that those drums have been stripped and stained, but for some reason, the rack tom came out differently than the other two drums. Or, maybe a past owner added the rack tom afterwards. I'm not sure.

It appears that the 13" rack tom has definitely had its badge removed and re-stained, but would you not say that the finish is original on both the floor tom and kick drum?

Many thanks for all of your input so far, really appreciated guys.

So I think its safe to say that at some point that 13" rack tom has had its badge removed and someone has attempted a re-stain but the interior seems to match the other shells and it does have the date stamp placing it in 1968 which correlates with its badge and its serial number is in close proximity to that of the other drums. With this in mind, would you say that this was the original rack tom that accompanied the floor tom and kick from the factory and that for whatever reason has been re-stained at some point? Or is there something not adding up with this rack tom? Here are a few additional photos of the interiors of each of the drums.

www.backwaterchannels.com
www.facebook.com/backwaterchannelsstudio
Posted on 4 years ago
#10
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