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60s Ludwig bearing edge advice

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Hi all,

I've searched and read a lot of advice about bearing edges in this forum, but hopefully someone experienced can chip in with a little advice.

I have a mid-60s Ludwig whose edges I need to recut. From what I understand the original edges are a 45° inner bevel and a 1/8" roundover counter cut. (Some say the inner bevel is closer to 30° but the original edges on mine are definitely 45°.) So this brings up some questions:

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[*]Do I hand shape the transition between the 45° and roundover edges to create the profile, or was the transition originally that sharp?

[*]What do I do to compensate for the seam? An inside pilot would follow the bump in the ring, an outside pilot would follow the bump in the wrap. I've seen where the drum is guided by blocks but I imagine the seam would still be an issue.

[*]I don't have the budget for a large router table. Any workarounds? Building my own, building a jig where the router is above, using a small table, etc.? I read on another forum where the builder used a handheld router mounted to a strip of Plexiglass, which seemed interesting.

[/LIST]

Any advice is greatly appreciated!

Posted on 11 years ago
#1
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Welcome to the forum!

45 degree on a 60's Ludwig kit? It 'should be' 30 degree back-cut with the 1/8th" round-over. If you bend a piece of 220 grit paper over the edge, holding it by the ends like a shoe-shine rag, you can buff it back and forth over the edge (as needed) to ease the transition.

Before cutting anything, make sure the edge is dead level all around. Take four sheets of 120 grit self-adhesive sand paper and stick them to a countertop (flattest surface you can find) butting the ends together to make a large square. Place the drum edge down on the paper and gently rock it from side to side a few times. Put a flash light inside the shell on its side and then look for light leaks from the outside of the shell. If you see any light peeking through, just grind the edge against the paper another few times until the shell is sitting perfectly flat (no light leaks) on the table/countertop. The leveling step is the first and most important part of the bearing edge fixing operation.

1. You 'can' free-hand the router cut by placing the shell on a flat hard-rubber mat, or something that won't slip, but I don't recommend it. Router table is definitely the way to go. (Unless you are an experienced hand with a router.)

2. You have to accurately mark the stops on the shell, route carefully and leave a 1/8th" at the seam to finish up with a fine rasp and sand paper - by hand. You don't want to continue the cut past the original starting point, or you'll just keep eating/cutting down into the shell.

I would recommend getting a router table if you're going to be cutting the edges yourself. Go over the edges with 00-00 steel wool after you cut and shape the edges. Seal them with butchers wax - again, using the 00-00 steel wool to apply the wax.

Hope this helps. There is plenty of stuff on You Tube demonstrating different ways to get the job done.

Post some photos of your drums, I'd like to see the kit you're trying to save.

John

Too many great drums to list here!

http://www.walbergandauge.com/VintageVenue.htm
Posted on 11 years ago
#2
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From Purdie Shuffle

45 degree on a 60's Ludwig kit? It 'should be' 30 degree back-cut with the 1/8th" round-over.

Yes, it's kind of an awkward kit. The floor's serial puts it a few years earlier than the toms, but everything is a matching BOP with wrapped seams. The floor and bass are mahogany inner plies, the rack toms are maple. The bass drum hoops seem a tad undersized, but have the matching original inlay. Compared to my other Ludwigs, this one seems like it was the most "put together on Friday at 4:45."

Thanks for the advice. I did a lot of YouTube searching, but the only things I found simply suggested used pilot bearings and zipping around the shell.

Post some photos of your drums, I'd like to see the kit you're trying to save.

Easier said than done — most of the drums are in some sort of repair. The biggest issues are the edges (over 1/8" (!) untrue in spots and totally destroyed on the bass drum) and black spray paint over the interior.

This 13" has been stripped and sanded and trued and is just waiting for me to get the courage to cut it.

Has anyone used a small benchtop router table to cut edges?

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Posted on 11 years ago
#3
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Ok, now it's starting to sound like you've never attempted this before. Do yourself a huge favor before you unintentionally mess up an old, rare vintage drum kit... let the pros do the edges for you. Practice on old beater shells that won't get you upset if you make a mistake. 'Learning' to cut bearing edges on a valuable vintage kit is a serious no-no.

Precision Drum Co. will do the edges on your drums for about $15.00 per edge. Check with them. What you will get back is; drums with perfectly restored vintage profile bearing edges. It's well-worth the extra expense to preserve those drums for the future. Like I said, practice on throw-aways, not your 60's Luddy kit.

Nice to meet you... you'll fit right in around here. Good bunch of guys, -very knowledgeable- about all things relating to drums. Stick around, jump in. The water is fine...

John

Too many great drums to list here!

http://www.walbergandauge.com/VintageVenue.htm
Posted on 11 years ago
#4
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I called Precision Drum Co. and talked with the guy that cuts the new edges. They have cut many and they are the experts. I agree with John, have them do the work for you. The guy at Precision (i forgot his name) told me that after he cuts the edges, the drums will tune really easy and sound "killer". I repaired some edges lately, I use an old mirror with sandpaper glued to it to true the edges up. If you cut them yourself, take your time and go slow. Good luck, Tommy

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Posted on 11 years ago
#5
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I'm sure Precision does great work — I normally use Sam Bacco in Nashville for edge work — but I'm looking to do these edges myself. Even if it's a "no-no." ;)

Posted on 11 years ago
#6
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Count the number of plies and see which one they centered the edge on, go from there.

They're your drums to do with as you please, hope you don't think I was trying to tell you what to do. Wasn't my intention.

John

Too many great drums to list here!

http://www.walbergandauge.com/VintageVenue.htm
Posted on 11 years ago
#7
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You've got some really good advice here already but I'll chime in a little. I re-cut all the edges on my late 60's Slingerland kit because they were chewed up beyond belief. Definitely get the edge flat first as Mr. Shuffle says. Don't run a router bit with a bearing on the re-ring. Not consistent I'm almost positive. Mine were roller coaster-ish. You need to do the inner bevel by hand with a rasp. I think you can do the outer round over if you carefully mark the apex and the ply it sits on and go from there. Use a different shell for a visual guide as to how the round over should look, etc... So you copy as best you can how it should look. My personal opinion is that the inner bevel doesn't matter all that much. It's getting the roundover that counts most.

Steve

1967 Slingerland 12,13,16,20 White Satin Flame
1968 Slingerland 12,14,16,20 Light Blue Pearl
Posted on 11 years ago
#8
Posts: 6524 Threads: 37
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From roger wilco

Yes, it's kind of an awkward kit. The floor's serial puts it a few years earlier than the toms, but everything is a matching BOP with wrapped seams. The floor and bass are mahogany inner plies, the rack toms are maple. The bass drum hoops seem a tad undersized, but have the matching original inlay. Compared to my other Ludwigs, this one seems like it was the most "put together on Friday at 4:45."Thanks for the advice. I did a lot of YouTube searching, but the only things I found simply suggested used pilot bearings and zipping around the shell.Easier said than done — most of the drums are in some sort of repair. The biggest issues are the edges (over 1/8" (!) untrue in spots and totally destroyed on the bass drum) and black spray paint over the interior.This 13" has been stripped and sanded and trued and is just waiting for me to get the courage to cut it.Has anyone used a small benchtop router table to cut edges?

What kind of router do you have, benchtop or handheld ?

It`s a drum,.....Hit It !!

.....76/#XK9207 Phonic Sound Machine D454/D-505 snares !i
Posted on 11 years ago
#9
Posts: 6524 Threads: 37
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The reason I ask is with a benchtop,...you secure the machine and move the stock,..with a handheld,..you secure the stock and move the machine !!

It`s a drum,.....Hit It !!

.....76/#XK9207 Phonic Sound Machine D454/D-505 snares !i
Posted on 11 years ago
#10
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