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  #1  
Old 07-03-2017, 12:19 PM
Mookie Mookie is offline
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Default Super Sensitive questions

The questions aren't all that sensitive,...Picked this sad example up over the weekend. I've always wanted an LM402, and when I saw this at Music Go Round, I couldn't stop myself. The whole package was confusing: Seemed to be a 402, but had Classic (Bowtie) lugs; some moron decided to put a crappy Taiwanese throwoff and butt on it, and cleverly moved them over one panel (where there was no snare bed...) Also seemed to have extra vent holes (?)... I'd never seen the seemingly factory reinforcement plates behind where the throw should've been either. And the factory hole pattern didn't look right for a P85 or P86. I didn't pay close enough attention, and thought it was a Monroe drum.
A little research when I got home says this: Those "extra" vent holes and the weird hole pattern point toward a Super-Sensitive mechanism; making this an LM411. And the badge is a large Keystone Chicago badge, which dates to 1985. Apparently, there are some documented LM411s from that era with the Bowtie lugs from the factory, making it kind of cool and rare.
But here's the problem - I don't have an SS mechanism for it; they're expensive, and I don't really need that type of sound for what I play (straight up R&R). The previous idiot drilled four new holes for the other hardware, and did a terrible job,so it'll only ever be a players drum (which is fine with me.) At least they're small holes. I'm inlined to drill four MORE holes to mount a P85 and butt on, the correct panel, and maybe carefully fill the non-factory holes (or not...) But the snare bed on this thing is barely noticeable, and I wonder if a P85 will do the job on this shell? In other words, will regular snares work well on this drum as-is? Plus, how much will the two big holes for the rod effect the sound?
What's my best option?

Sorry, can't get pictures to upload- first it said something about a security token, then it just said "upload failed" repeatedly. Weird, I've done it before without problems...
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  #2  
Old 07-03-2017, 10:34 PM
Mookie Mookie is offline
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Default Re: Super Sensitive questions

Okay, maybe pics will work now and stimulate the conversation...

Well, it's a low res picture of a picture, but seemed to work.
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  #3  
Old 07-03-2017, 10:37 PM
Mookie Mookie is offline
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Default Re: Super Sensitive questions

what the, another try at a picture.
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  #4  
Old 07-04-2017, 10:13 AM
K.O. K.O. is offline
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Default Re: Super Sensitive questions

The snare bed on all acoustic-perfect shells (Supra, SS, Acro) is the same regardless of the throw off. It's very shallow and wide so it's hard to see unless the drum is on a flat surface. So if you install a P-83/85/86 (or any other strainer, perhaps an INDe) you'll have the equivalent of a 402 except for the added holes.

That drum would be from approx. 1984 because that was the only year with that particular badge. I have a 402 with that same badge. Mine has the Imperial lugs but many metal snares from that year have the Bowtie lugs. It is theorized that Ludwig ran short of Imperials and rather than order in more stock with a major move impending they simply switched to using Bowties. The 75th anniversary bronze shelled snare drum of that year also had Bowties in place of Imperials so that anniversary might have something to do with it as well.

I doubt the extra holes would make much difference in the sound but you could fill them with small chrome button head or carriage bolts.
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Old 07-04-2017, 10:34 AM
Mookie Mookie is offline
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Default Re: Super Sensitive questions

Thanks for the info. I'm glad to hear the snare beds are the same, so I believe I will go ahead with a P85 replacement. I'll clean the new holes up (i.e. de-bur them, cause they're a mess) and see how it sounds before deciding on any filling.

I think I have solved my picture post issues by shooting TINY jpgs; I'll (hopefully) attach a couple as it currently looks, partly disassembled.
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  #6  
Old 07-14-2017, 06:13 PM
Mookie Mookie is offline
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Default Re: Super Sensitive questions

Now that I have my throw off and butt, can anyone give me measurements on where they should be on the shell? Should the throw off be centered over the bead? How low should the butt be for an LM402?

Thanks.
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