Vintage Drum Forum the best vintage drum forum on the Internet - Vintage Drum History - Vintage Drum Questions

Go Back   Vintage Drum Forum > Vintage Drums

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 06-07-2018, 11:49 PM
zenstat zenstat is online now
Vintage Drum Guru
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 1,521
Default Re: eBay

Quote:
Originally Posted by idrum4fun View Post
Here's an example of what's going on... https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-196...d=282984166573

However, as mentioned above, there is a message that says "The listing you're looking for is no longer available...". Just click where it says "listing" and it will take you to the original item. In this case, it was for a "Slingerland" snare drum that is anything but a Slingerland! I messaged the seller about this and he never responded. What is even more odd are the bids from people who seem to believe it's a Slingerland snare drum! It sold for $142.50! I don't get it!

-Mark
Thanks for the link. Very helpful. What the eBay programmers have done is substituted a new URL with a variable at the end ?oid=282984166573 which is the item link you should have been going to. The variable oid would mean "original" (or maybe "old)" id prior to the unwanted replacement. It turns out they have another variable &nordt which if set to true on an otherwise simple URL to an item number shuts off the redirection (hence that variable name nordt = no redirection). Here is the canonical form (shortest possible with all the other unnecessary stuff taken out) to go to the original auction:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/282984166573?nordt=true

I save eBay URLs in one field of my database and now I know how I can always get around the changes they have made recently. Naughty eBay programmers.

It would be useful to know how you came by this particular link. Was it something saved in your watchlist and when you clicked on it you were taken somewhere else? Was it a link which was sent to you in an email via a saved search? Was it the result of a search of completed auctions? All of these (and there are more) will be different pieces of code which can be doing this re-writing of URLs. I wonder if we can track it down further and thus learn more about how to avoid it.
__________________
For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert, but for every fact there is not necessarily an equal and opposite fact (Thomas Sowell, 1995 in The Vision of the Anointed)

Paiste 602/Sound Creation research click here
Which K Stamp? A DIY tool click here
Old K prices and weights click here
Avedis Zildjian gallery and timeline click here
Old A prices and weights click here

Last edited by zenstat; 06-08-2018 at 12:49 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-07-2018, 11:55 PM
zenstat zenstat is online now
Vintage Drum Guru
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 1,521
Default Re: eBay

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlayton View Post
Ebay has certainly made some changes recently. Doing a saved search, I could previously click on Advanced and check for completed and sold listings. The words in the search field carried over to the advanced search. it no longer does this. And yes, lots of items sold now divert you to something that appears to be an item of Ebay's choice. Other changes as well that I cannot recall at the moment. Not real thrilled with it.

Mike
Yes I noticed that too Mike. Advanced either loses your search terms (not helpful) or in other contexts it sometimes reverts to an "all of eBay" search instead of whatever category (say, vintage drums) you started in. Not an improvement.

I'm not sure how much of this is down to some script kiddies trying to make the smartphone app for eBay behave in a way they think is "clever". Young people these days...
__________________
For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert, but for every fact there is not necessarily an equal and opposite fact (Thomas Sowell, 1995 in The Vision of the Anointed)

Paiste 602/Sound Creation research click here
Which K Stamp? A DIY tool click here
Old K prices and weights click here
Avedis Zildjian gallery and timeline click here
Old A prices and weights click here
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-08-2018, 12:56 AM
Dan Boucher Dan Boucher is offline
Vintage Drum Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,248
Default Re: eBay

I tried hitting the "listing" Slingerfan, as noted above, and it worked. Thanks for the head's up on that.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-08-2018, 11:08 AM
slingerfan slingerfan is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 432
Default Re: eBay

My pleasure, I just stumbled upon it by accident. By the way, I really enjoy reading everyone on this threads posts (Dan, Hobbs, idrum4fun, mlayton, zenstat). Some of the forums heavy hitters!
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-08-2018, 11:16 AM
slingerfan slingerfan is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 432
Default Re: eBay

[QUOTE=zenstat;
It would be useful to know how you came by this particular link. Was it something saved in your watchlist and when you clicked on it you were taken somewhere else? Was it a link which was sent to you in an email via a saved search? Was it the result of a search of completed auctions? All of these (and there are more) will be different pieces of code which can be doing this re-writing of URLs. I wonder if we can track it down further and thus learn more about how to avoid it.[/QUOTE]

zenstat,
I got the link in question by clicking items saved in my watch list and also while searching sold listings.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 06-08-2018, 08:35 PM
idrum4fun idrum4fun is offline
Vintage Drum Guru
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,096
Default Re: eBay

I got the link from a snare drum I was watching. After it sold, I was redirected to "similar" snare drums. At the time, I wasn't aware of the link I could click to show the original post. What's odd is that, so far, this is not standard practice for eBay. Many items I watch, whether drum related or not, don't exhibit this issue.

-Mark
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 06-08-2018, 09:15 PM
zenstat zenstat is online now
Vintage Drum Guru
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 1,521
Default Re: eBay

Quote:
Originally Posted by idrum4fun View Post
I got the link from a snare drum I was watching. After it sold, I was redirected to "similar" snare drums. At the time, I wasn't aware of the link I could click to show the original post. What's odd is that, so far, this is not standard practice for eBay. Many items I watch, whether drum related or not, don't exhibit this issue.

-Mark
I'm just guessing but it may turn out that the programmers use a simple metric to assess "similarity" to the item you were watching. Things like matches on model, type, brand, MPN, UPC (these are fields which you can see on listings). Or maybe they are using all the words in the ad title. If they get a high enough score for a "similar" item they do the naughty re-writing of the URL and send you somewhere else. If they find no item which is sufficiently "similar" then they don't do the naughty re-writing.

Since this has come up I've had a look at when they re-write and when they don't. Their basic problem is the can't tell quality and vintage. My examples are cymbal related (hey, I'm a specialist) but bear with me.

I had a Spizzichino 18" on my watch list, and they didn't get any listings "similar" enough. So far so good. But when I followed a recently sold Paiste Signature Series 18" Flat Ride (sought after discontinued model) their system happily took me to Paiste PST 3 18" Crash Ride. So that tells me everything I need to know about the failings of their metric as far as "similar" goes. They can't tell quality line from entry level, they can't tell models (a flat ride is not a crash ride unless you know nothing about drums and cymbals), and they can't distinguish vintage and discontinued series from current production. They seem to know brand and diameter and nothing about cymbals. I've since had a look at a few other sold auctions and confirmed their stunning lack of what we in the biz call "domain specific knowledge".

Remember that the naughty re-writing might only be triggered by auctions which are marked with the Sold outcome, and not those which go away for other reasons. I haven't followed up on that yet, and really I'd rather get on with my "proper" research. But at a glance "no longer available" might not be redirecting, auctions which finish with no bids might not redirect. And relists don't seem to cause the redirecting even when the seller has cheated and put up an entirely different sort of item in as if it is a relist. But then this one

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Zildjian-14...vip=true&rt=nc

doesn't redirect and I don't know why. Although I do know that the seller has misidentified a very late 1950s cymbal as a 1930s. But I wouldn't expect the eBay programmers to know that either.
__________________
For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert, but for every fact there is not necessarily an equal and opposite fact (Thomas Sowell, 1995 in The Vision of the Anointed)

Paiste 602/Sound Creation research click here
Which K Stamp? A DIY tool click here
Old K prices and weights click here
Avedis Zildjian gallery and timeline click here
Old A prices and weights click here

Last edited by zenstat; 06-08-2018 at 09:17 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 06-10-2018, 04:16 PM
zenstat zenstat is online now
Vintage Drum Guru
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 1,521
Default Re: eBay

Here's another example of how shallow algorithms used by the eBay programmers sometimes send you off to things which humans would know are not a match. The word "signature" is shared by a Paiste line and some sort of women's boots so we get...
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	you-may-also-like.jpg
Views:	10
Size:	15.8 KB
ID:	119370  
__________________
For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert, but for every fact there is not necessarily an equal and opposite fact (Thomas Sowell, 1995 in The Vision of the Anointed)

Paiste 602/Sound Creation research click here
Which K Stamp? A DIY tool click here
Old K prices and weights click here
Avedis Zildjian gallery and timeline click here
Old A prices and weights click here
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:36 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2009 VSDwebdesign